ELF pedal electric car on W&OD

[Steve O]

@PotomacCyclist 127478 wrote:

So while 33 mph is notable, it’s good to compare that to the behavior of other trail users on those sections.

Vienna to Hunter Mill. Some recognizable names dusting the guy in the ELF–or at least keeping up:
[ATTACH=CONFIG]10047[/ATTACH]

[PotomacCyclist]

So this means that it would be problematic to go after ELFman solely based on his speed. If he felt like he were getting hassled online, he could turn the tables and criticize cyclists for maintaining the same or similar speeds. Of course, the size of his vehicle and the add-on power source makes him different from cyclists, but not everyone is going to recognize those differences in a dispute. Just pointing out the need to be careful about how to look at ELFman.

[hozn]

@PotomacCyclist 127501 wrote:

So this means that it would be problematic to go after ELFman solely based on his speed. If he felt like he were getting hassled online, he could turn the tables and criticize cyclists for maintaining the same or similar speeds. Of course, the size of his vehicle and the add-on power source makes him different from cyclists, but not everyone is going to recognize those differences in a dispute. Just pointing out the need to be careful about how to look at ELFman.

I think the speed is still very high. A 17 mile MUP trip averaging 20.5 mph (including stops) is very fast. Strava does not include stopped time for overall rides (though it does for segments). — And while apparently I can ride the uninterrupted stretch from Vienna to HunterMill at 26.3mph with a tailwind, I have probably only broken 19mph average [excluding stopped time] for the ~15-mile commute on a handful of very favorable occasions [early am/no cars, tailwind, etc.].

Edit: I note his site does say “Average speed moving”, so the average of 20.5 mph may not be *quite* as crazy as it sounded at first, though it is still a lot faster than other trail users. (Perhaps cyclists using the MUP for race training would be faster, but I think we’d all agree they also should be on the roads.)

[PotomacCyclist]

I agree that the speed is high and likely excessive and dangerous for other trail users, although it depends on the section of the trail. I’m just pointing out that if a lot of people criticize him for that speed, he (and any supporters he may or may not have) can look at other users and go after them as well. Glass houses and all.

I haven’t ridden on the W&OD in a while, maybe in over a year. I do remember that on some of the long straightaways, especially west of Vienna, that I rode faster than I would ride on the busier Mt. Vernon Trail in Arlington. I’m not supporting this guy. I haven’t encountered him personally, so all I can go on is what people have posted here. I guess I’m playing devil’s advocate here, to help clean up the online case against ELFman. If the initial group of complaints against him turns out to be sloppy, then it would be more difficult in the future to get NPS or other groups to take the complaints seriously.

[bentbike33]

What about something like this?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadracycle#/media/File:Quattrocycle_with_canopy.jpg

Wider and heavier than ELFman, but no motor.

[Drewdane]

@bentbike33 127509 wrote:

What about something like this?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadracycle#/media/File:Quattrocycle_with_canopy.jpg

Wider and heavier than ELFman, but no motor.

I doubt it could reach the same speeds, but the sheer size of that thing makes it inappropriate for local MUPs IMO.

[Steve O]

@bentbike33 127509 wrote:

What about something like this?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadracycle#/media/File:Quattrocycle_with_canopy.jpg

Wider and heavier than ELFman, but no motor.

My family and I rode on something like this along the boardwalk in Virginia Beach. I believe we broke 4mph on one slight downgrade stretch.

[Vicegrip]

@Steve O 127499 wrote:

Vienna to Hunter Mill. Some recognizable names dusting the guy in the ELF–or at least keeping up:
[ATTACH=CONFIG]10047[/ATTACH]

Rut rho. I know that Kurt Mickelwait guy, total coffee shop poseur, no way he torched that out without PEDs. :rolleyes: Went back and looked at the ride where this segment was that placed my name above the others. overall was in my normal 18 or less mph and the out and back speed for Vienna to hunter mill was 19 something. 22 mph over long stretches of mid W&OD is very fast and I suspect requires the car to go well over standard speeds to make up for the places where it has to over slow.

Keep in mind that we are talking about 200 pounds of bike and rider that is a human wide. The empty weight of the elf is that alone and you have to almost double the total mass with a rider. Energy increases on the square so doubling the mass and adding over 2 mph of average speed in a huge jump in impact kinetic energy. On a strong day my best average from Purcellville to Falls church is 18 mph. I am courteous to others and Slow/peek/stop at intersections and am far more maneuverable than the Elf. I have watched it have to way over slow and pick its way through areas where a bike simply rolls along.

2 days ago I watched the Elf just past Vienna I was moving East as the Elf went West. The car had to go 2 wheels off to pass a string of 3 bikes in my lane. I watched the reaction of the cyclists as they saw the Elf oncoming was very telling to me. All three checked up and dove right. Even with the bikes going to the edge of the lane the Elf wobbled a bit and ended up wheels off. if the Elf had been a bike all would have continued as if the others were not there. This is Key. Skip the numbers game which is the playground of obfuscators.
The Elf is disruptive on MUPs even in single form. If there were 10X Elf’s it would be a goat screw.

[Rod Smith]

What about that jerk who rides the Teddy Roosevelt Bridge sidewalk towing his huge trailer? Last week an old man had to remove a wheel from his tricycle to let the self-entitled trailerman get by.

[dasgeh]

But the issue with the ELF is the width. It’s simply too wide for MUPs.

[KLizotte]

Has anyone sent his webpage to the police? Seems like it would be easy for the police to catch him.

Another way to stop him would be if cyclists simply blocked his path every time he showed up.

I really wish there was a way to accommodate these new energy efficient vehicles though.

[jabberwocky]

@dasgeh 127599 wrote:

But the issue with the ELF is the width. It’s simply too wide for MUPs.

My issue is its a car, as much as their website wants to pretend otherwise. Its large, its enclosed, its motorized. It may be lighter and smaller than your average honda accord, but its certainly not proper for narrow pedestrian trails and sidewalks. The precedent that any goober with 6 grand to burn can buy one of these things and start flying down the W&OD at high speeds is one I find rather worrying.

@KLizotte 127609 wrote:

I really wish there was a way to accommodate these new energy efficient vehicles though.

…roads?

[baiskeli]

@Raymo853 127326 wrote:

There is an article on the Catholic Herald, about him and his ELF titled “Biking for God’s creation ” I will paste in one quote: “I get a lot of thumbs-up from people while driving down the bike path.”

http://www.catholicherald.com/stories/Biking-for-Gods-creation,29561

“Ed Myers, a Sterling resident and a parishioner of Christ the Redeemer Church, has a new, environmentally friendly vehicle he uses to get to work.”

Yeah, so do the rest of us. Big deal.

The article also says he was banned from the WOD but appealed – so if he’s there again, he’s either ignoring the ban or NVRPA has told him he’s allowed.

[JimK]

Help me out. I thought no motorized vehicles were allowed on the W&OD, including electric powered or assisted bikes. Is that correct?

[Rod Smith]

@dasgeh 127599 wrote:

But the issue with the ELF is the width. It’s simply too wide for MUPs.

Well, if I didn’t have to negotiate the bollards on Penn Ave near the White House I might have purchased the double wide (64AW). http://www.bikesatwork.com/bike-trailers/specifications#

As it is, the width is a problem on the TR bridge sidewalk. Most people are cool about having to slow to get past me but some give me dirty looks. I do stop but not until I’m pretty close to the oncoming rider.

I’ve actually turned around on that sidewalk. That wasn’t easy or fun.

At 30 inches I’m nowhere near the width of an Elf though (48in). I’d love to watch him take on the TR bridge sidewalk at 20mph!

[Author]

Posts