ELF pedal electric car on W&OD

[kcb203]

What do you think of the ELF pedal powered electric car that is always out on the W&OD between Vienna and Reston? I don’t like seeing it out there because it’s too big, blocks visibility, and the guy drives it like a maniac. I like the idea of the vehicle, but just don’t think it should be on multi-use trails that specifically prohibit motorized vehicles. It’s too bad there’s no real home for it, though, because I wouldn’t feel comfortable in one on the road, either.

Call me a hypocrite, but I have no problem with electric assist bicycles as long as they stick to normal cycling speeds. I guess my big problem with the ELF is the size.

[Subby]

No real opinion other than it looks cool as sh!t.

[video=youtube_share;pQQzLMIXOJ0]https://youtu.be/pQQzLMIXOJ0[/video]

[runbike]

I’ve seen plenty of recumbent trikes that take up almost as much space on the MUPs…

[ShawnoftheDread]

Just shake your fist at him and tell him to “get a bike, ya freak!”

[83b]

@kcb203 127261 wrote:

and the guy drives it like a maniac.

I think that’s where I consider the line to be. I ride my ebike on the MVT when I have to go somewhere in Crystal City/Alexandria, but I know that I’m breaking a rule to do it and so try to be extra conscientious. If this dude was riding conservatively and as politely as possible, I doubt we’d think twice about him beyond, “That’s nifty looking. Bet it’s nice in the rain and a pain in high winds.”

[strike]As someone else noted, the ELF isn’t much wider than a fully pedal-powered bakfiets or recumbent. While I wouldn’t want to come across any of those on the really narrow bridges/underpasses on the MVT, they should still be able to use a mixed use network safely.[/strike]EDIT: Someone else noted I’m wrong about the relative width.

[Vicegrip]

@kcb203 127261 wrote:

What do you think of the ELF pedal powered electric car that is always out on the W&OD between Vienna and Reston? I don’t like seeing it out there because it’s too big, blocks visibility, and the guy drives it like a maniac. I like the idea of the vehicle, but just don’t think it should be on multi-use trails that specifically prohibit motorized vehicles. It’s too bad there’s no real home for it, though, because I wouldn’t feel comfortable in one on the road, either.

Call me a hypocrite, but I have no problem with electric assist bicycles as long as they stick to normal cycling speeds. I guess my big problem with the ELF is the size.

I have been pondering this for a bit and figured I would give it some time and observation before commenting. I have watched and rode behind it a few times. One ride was for a long while after he came onto the W&OD at the Follin lane connector and headed west. Notes I have on this car. Don’t know the driver and no grumpy on my part.

When it is a bit ahead of you the car is very hard to see around. Planning ahead is tough.
It has a bit of a time getting around people being passed. Interrupts the flow of things at times
It has to over slow at times to maneuver.
It takes up a full lane and any normal amount wiggle puts it in the other lane.
The driver tends to take his 1/2 more in the middle whenever it is available.
The driver is not always 100% courteous or I think better said is not always understanding of the disruption the car causes.
It looks to me like it is being used more as a an electric car with pedals than a pedal car with elec assist if that makes any sense.

My take is this. If there is only one it is an oddity but we should think of how it would be if 20% of the bikes were replaced with this car. I think it would be a royal mess. Sure on the clean wide straights on the west end of the W&OD it can fit but get inside the beltway on custiss or the like and you have real problems. Picture one going up and one going down the S curve of doom, working their way through the Roosevelt parking lot area or anywhere around national airport. 99.2% of the pavement in this area is intended primarily for cars. There are but a few strips of pavement that are intended and sized for meat / feet powered movement. An electric bike is different than an pedal assist electric car. Unlike the car the bike has the same working with others aspects of a regular bike but can make it so anyone can ride like they are fit.

[jabberwocky]

I’ve not come across it, but after looking it up online, I don’t think anything that large and motorized should be on the W&OD. Its over 4′ wide (which is wider than pretty much any recumbent trike on the market); considering lane widths on the W&OD vary from 4-5 feet, its almost impossible not to be taking up more than one lane. Its also 9′ long and over 5′ high and weighs, by itself, 160-200 pounds and is capable of motor-only speeds over 20+mph. Thats an awful big, massive vehicle for a MUP IMO.

[AFHokie]

@Subby 127263 wrote:

No real opinion other than it looks cool as sh!t.

[video=youtube_share;pQQzLMIXOJ0]https://youtu.be/pQQzLMIXOJ0[/video]

Oddly, I think I’d hate to encounter an ELF on the trail even more than the jackass riding his gas powered scooter I encountered under 395 on 4MRT a few weeks ago.

[jabberwocky]

@run/bike 127264 wrote:

I’ve seen plenty of recumbent trikes that take up almost as much space on the MUPs…

Point me at a recumbent trike that is anywhere close to the dimensions of an ELF. Their website lists the footprint as 4’x9′. A brief look at trikes from popular mfgs like Catrike or ICE show their larger road trikes as about 2′-8″x6′ or so, which is substantially smaller. And thats ignoring that a recumbent trike is all of 2.5-3′ high, which is a height that is easy to see over for most people, whereas the ELF is 5′-1″, which is only 5″ shorter than a Ford Escape SUV.

[chris_s]

@jabberwocky 127289 wrote:

Point me at a recumbent trike that is anywhere close to the dimensions of an ELF. Their website lists the footprint as 4’x9′. A brief look at trikes from popular mfgs like Catrike or ICE show their larger road trikes as about 2′-8″x6′ or so, which is substantially smaller. And thats ignoring that a recumbent trike is all of 2.5-3′ high, which is a height that is easy to see over for most people, whereas the ELF is 5′-1″, which is only 5″ shorter than a Ford Escape SUV.

As another point of comparison, my Bakfiets is close to that long, but only half as wide.

[Starduster]

It is cool, but (my opinion) it’s just too wide for many of our trails, let alone a sidewalk. And perhaps too fast and powerful to play safely with bikes on those trails.

[bobco85]

Food for thought from the ELF owner’s website: http://www.solarbikecar.com/SolarBikeCar.aspx#tab-31

Karl Mohle, Park Manager of the W&OD Railroad Regional Park sent this via email:

“Upon reviewing the information on the Internet the ELF has an electric motor on it. As such motorized vehicles are currently not permitted on the trail. Furthermore the width of the ELF creates a safety hazard on the trail for users in the opposite lane. Here is a copy of the guidelines from our friends group website: http://www.wodfriends.org/accessibility/safety/

He provides a rebuttal directly underneath this, but according to his own website, the ELF is not allowed on the trail although the law might be on his side.

Another bit of food for thought: he has modified the ELF to go faster (this information is on that page).

To be honest, I wasn’t sure at first whether the ELF electric bicycle should be allowed on trails until I started researching the topic and running through this list in my head:

Would you be okay with seeing the ELF electric bicycle in these locations?

• W&OD Trail – kinda
• Key Bridge sidewalk – no
• 14th St Bridge path – kinda
• Mount Vernon Trail – not really
• Anacostia River Tributary Trail System – not really
• Penn Ave protected bike lane – yes
• 1st St NE protected bike lane – yes
• Rock Creek Trail – no
• C&O Canal Towpath – kinda
• average suburban sidewalk – no
• average city sidewalk – no

After running down the list, my answers to places that ELF electric bicycles should be allowed: no on sidewalks, no on trails, and yes in bike lanes.

[jabberwocky]

@bobco85 127300 wrote:

Food for thought from the ELF owner’s website: http://www.solarbikecar.com/SolarBikeCar.aspx#tab-31

He provides a rebuttal directly underneath this, but according to his own website, the ELF is not allowed on the trail although the law might be on his side.

Another bit of food for thought: he has modified the ELF to go faster (this information is on that page).

What a self righteous douchecanoe.

This right here perfectly encapsulates why I will forever be opposed to anything motorized on MUPs. Because it’s sold as “it’s basically a bike, hardly any power at all, honest!” And then you get idiots like this guy basically driving their electric SUV down a MUP and claiming “I’m allowed to do this!”

[GovernorSilver]

I think it should be made wider, no longer subject to the federal 20 mph limit on electric motors so it can be driven on any road like any other car, and officially classified as a motor vehicle (and not a bicycle/tricycle) – effectively banning it from MUPs forever (too wide and too fast).

After these changes are made, I’d love to have one – as my next car.

[hozn]

Indeed, what a jackhole. I have passed this (oncoming) numerous times now and it is definitely too wide to stay in a lane on the W&OD, nevermind passing others. Or maybe it fits in a lane, but the owner has an SUV mentality and just drives down the middle of the trail.

It looks like a fun vehicle to drive in the street. Isn’t that the whole frickin point?

[Author]

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