e-Bikes – Let’s talk

[TwoWheelsDC]

@sjclaeys 167020 wrote:

The pedestrian killed by a cyclist this past March was the first time that this happened in the DC area since 2012. It is also only the 9th such incident since 1905. You have an interesting definition of “every once-in-a-while”. BTW, here’s the source for my info: http://www.thewashcycle.com/2017/03/pedestrian-struck-by-cyclist-in-downtown-dc-dies-from-injuriess-.html

Ah yes, data! There have been four pedestrians killed by bikes in this area since 2007…so one every two-ish years or so. E-bikes have killed a pedestrian precisely never, so I dunno, maybe let’s not clutch those pearls quite so tightly?

[huskerdont]

@TwoWheelsDC 167021 wrote:

Ah yes, data! There have been four pedestrians killed by bikes in this area since 2007…so one every two-ish years or so. E-bikes have killed a pedestrian precisely never, so I dunno, maybe let’s not clutch those pearls quite so tightly?

The point is that the numbers of ebikes are increasing, and they are at times being operated in a manner that is less safe than that of regular bikes. Saying no one has been killed yet when their growth has only just begun isn’t really an especially good use of data. Some people feel that the increased danger needs to be addressed before bad things happen. If you disagree, fine, but belittling the poster with “clutching the pearls” for concern about the issue is rather counterproductive.

[EasyRider]

@huskerdont 167013 wrote:

The general public will not differentiate between ebikes and regular bikes

Yep, that’s the future. All of the big bike companies are betting big on e-bikes, and in 10 years, every other “bike” will be an e-bike.

[zsionakides]

@dasgeh 166979 wrote:

I know plenty of roadies that have rides where 22.4mph is their 75 percentile

The only way a roadie is doing that speed on a trail is if the trail is empty. This is the type of speed you would do at Hains Point or on a road. Trails are way too winding and full or people to go that fast. An e-bike OTOH, could quite easily, as they can push speeds on hills and out of turns most road bike riders can’t sustain.

[hozn]

So I commuted on the W&OD at 4am yesterday and 3am today; the nice thing about riding at that hour is not having to stop, but my average was still only 18mph. I could have pushed a little harder, but that was fast for me. There are definitely much faster people — and truer “roadies” — out there, but averaging 22 mph on a commute sounds like it might be a push for a pro. And it would clearly be really reckless on a MUP if ridden at a time other than 3am or 4am

Now 22+mph for a fast (HP) group ride or certainly a race, where drafting is involved, sure. I got the sense that Americancyclo’s flyby was not from a road race.

[huskerdont]

@hozn 167036 wrote:

So I commuted on the W&OD at 4am yesterday and 3am today

This part is just plain wrong.

[Crickey7]

@EasyRider 167027 wrote:

in 10 years, every other “bike” will be an e-bike.

Right now, a very high percentage of bikes sold each year are Huffy-type bikes retailing for $350-$400. And many of those bikes get ridden around 3 times a year. If ebikes don’t get close to that price, they won’t sell more than a relatively small share of that market because most bikes are not being sold for transportation or even regular recreation. To hit that kind of share, E bikes would have to create their market, not cannibalize the existing market.

[secstate]

On recent visits to NYC, I’ve noticed a remarkable number of e-bikes — and not the pedal-assist kind — in spite of their being banned in the city. It definitely changed my perception of how popular they’re likely to become. Given how heavily they are being marketed, it doesn’t seem crazy to me that within a decade a large percentage (though perhaps not half) of bike sales will be electric or e-assist.

https://patch.com/new-york/new-york-city/illegal-electric-bikes-will-get-restaurants-slapped-fines

edit: Seems many of these bikes are for restaurant delivery

[lordofthemark]

@Crickey7 167079 wrote:

Right now, a very high percentage of bikes sold each year are Huffy-type bikes retailing for $350-$400. And many of those bikes get ridden around 3 times a year. If ebikes don’t get close to that price, they won’t sell more than a relatively small share of that market because most bikes are not being sold for transportation or even regular recreation. To hit that kind of share, E bikes would have to create their market, not cannibalize the existing market.

Sure.

But both as a trail user, and as an advocate, I am more concerned about the percentages of bikes on the trails, not the percentages in people’s garages.

Note, the rising share of ebikes BEING RIDDEN, simply means addressing them is urgent. It does not lean one way or the other as far as policy. Both the problems with them, and the potential benefits increase with more ebikes.

[EasyRider]

I was using a figure of speech. Apologies. Let me put it differently. My best guesstimate is in 10 years, e-bikes will make up about half of the commuter bikes one sees on a typical commute downtown. E-bikes do create a new market, and that’s why manufacturers love them.

[creadinger]

@secstate 167080 wrote:

On recent visits to NYC, I’ve noticed a remarkable number of e-bikes — and not the pedal-assist kind — in spite of their being banned in the city. It definitely changed my perception of how popular they’re likely to become. Given how heavily they are being marketed, it doesn’t seem crazy to me that within a decade a large percentage (though perhaps not half) of bike sales will be electric or e-assist.

https://patch.com/new-york/new-york-city/illegal-electric-bikes-will-get-restaurants-slapped-fines

edit: Seems many of these bikes are for restaurant delivery

This is what I witnessed in Sydney, Australia too. A lot more e-bikes than expected, (WAY more than here) and a large proportion of seemed to be for local food deliveries. Deliveroo, and Foodora were two companies I remember seeing on the backpack or trunk cubes. I imagine it will only be a matter of time before they come to our large cities too.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]15647[/ATTACH]

[secstate]

UPS is making its love affair with bike lanes official (at least in Portland)

https://www.treehugger.com/bikes/ups-trials-e-bike-delivery-where-else-portland.html

[ATTACH=CONFIG]15648[/ATTACH]

[Dewey]

@secstate 167108 wrote:

UPS is making its love affair with bike lanes official (at least in Portland)

Interesting looking vehicle. A promotional video video (with groovetastic soundtrack) lists the trailer as 4 feet wide and shows it being ridden on a section of sidewalk between two traffic bollards. The poor 500W motor is being severely worked hauling its 250lb unladen weight plus a claimed 600lb payload, unsure if that includes the rider.

Proposed Halloween model?

[dasgeh]

@zsionakides 167030 wrote:

The only way a roadie is doing that speed on a trail is if the trail is empty. This is the type of speed you would do at Hains Point or on a road. Trails are way too winding and full or people to go that fast. An e-bike OTOH, could quite easily, as they can push speeds on hills and out of turns most road bike riders can’t sustain.

@hozn 167036 wrote:

So I commuted on the W&OD at 4am yesterday and 3am today; the nice thing about riding at that hour is not having to stop, but my average was still only 18mph. I could have pushed a little harder, but that was fast for me. There are definitely much faster people — and truer “roadies” — out there, but averaging 22 mph on a commute sounds like it might be a push for a pro. And it would clearly be really reckless on a MUP if ridden at a time other than 3am or 4am

Now 22+mph for a fast (HP) group ride or certainly a race, where drafting is involved, sure. I got the sense that Americancyclo’s flyby was not from a road race.

Not debating whether this is a good idea, just whether there are folks around here that are capable of doing this on a road bike. Yes, there are. Plenty of them. If we’re going to ban folks based on ability to go fast, then those guys would be banned too.

[dasgeh]

@Crickey7 167079 wrote:

To hit that kind of share, E bikes would have to create their market, not cannibalize the existing market.

Yep, that’s what the companies are gunning for — converting people who don’t bike now to people who do using ebikes. Why wouldn’t we want to support that?

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