New "speed control" bariers at Roosevelt Island

Our Community Forums Road and Trail Conditions New "speed control" bariers at Roosevelt Island

Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 143 total)
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  • #925254
    Dirt
    Participant

    The barrier was intact on the ride home, so my guess is that the gaps that I saw this morning was the work of some bandits.

    #925256
    DismalScientist
    Participant

    Can they pave a path and cut the curb to the immediate north of the west dog leg? This area clearly sees northbound foot and bike traffic and enters the parking lot where there are no bike spaces and so doesn’t take up parking spaces. This would, of course (horrors of horrors!) encourage folks to ride in the parking lot between the east and west curb cuts. …But I’m sure that doesn’t happen now. :)

    #925260
    DismalScientist
    Participant

    Here a link to the appropriate rut to be paved:
    http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=22205&aq=&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=60.50566,135.263672&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Arlington,+Virginia+22205&ll=38.896876,-77.067209&spn=0.001845,0.004128&t=h&z=19&layer=c&cbll=38.896762,-77.06716&panoid=wdfm6-BEP7xr92xnG7r8vw&cbp=12,196.29,,0,9.91

    If you move around streetview, it is clear that joggers already use this route. It is unclear if this is an official jogging route because I can’t tell whether they are wearing ear buds. :)

    #925264
    brendan
    Participant

    I suppose there’s a conflict here between “desire lines” and the existing infrastructure. There may be no easy & cheap fix in this case, but someone with Arlington or the NPS (depending on jurisdiction) should consider taking this on as a project…

    Brendan

    #925265
    DaveK
    Participant

    This area is under NPS jurisdiction, direct your comments there.

    #925266
    Dirt
    Participant

    @DismalScientist 2797 wrote:

    Here a link to the appropriate rut to be paved:
    http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=22205&aq=&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=60.50566,135.263672&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Arlington,+Virginia+22205&ll=38.896876,-77.067209&spn=0.001845,0.004128&t=h&z=19&layer=c&cbll=38.896762,-77.06716&panoid=wdfm6-BEP7xr92xnG7r8vw&cbp=12,196.29,,0,9.91

    If you move around streetview, it is clear that joggers already use this route. It is unclear if this is an official jogging route because I can’t tell whether they are wearing ear buds. :)

    Awesome that this was captured. It perfectly shows the problems. Thank you.

    #925273
    Tim Kelley
    Participant

    I was able to track down the folks at National Park Service who were able to provide some answers. With construction going on, the NPS would like to keep bikers/runners away from construction equipment to minimize possible congestion/collision issues.

    This is the more in depth answer:

    “The barricades were installed because of temporary construction/repair to the fountain on TR Island and the need for equipment access to the bridge from the parking lot. With the temporary need for equipment access to the bridge and the congestion of multiple users weaving in the same area, the NPS felt it best to add the barriers to formalize the separation of MVT users from bridge users for safety issues. This may be only a slight reduction in the weaving/congestion but it is still a reduction and hopefully will make all users more cognizant of their fellow users. I’ve also been told that a temporary speed table will be installed connecting the MVT between the north and south parking lots, also as a measure to improve bicycle safety and to encourage the MVT users to stay on the MVT through this congested area. The plastic barriers are temporary meaning until construction is complete on TR Island (end of June/early July).”

    So hopefully we’ll only have to deal with the barriers for a couple months but, as mentioned before this can be a very busy area of the trail, in the meantime everyone should use caution in the area.

    #924715
    Mark Blacknell
    Participant

    “Speed table” is a large & flat speed bump that MVT users would traverse lengthwise, yes? Hmm. Possibly good.

    The reason I never take the MVT (and always the parking lot) is that kids tend to dart onto the trail from between the cars, and you have zero time to see them, even at low speeds. Compare to the parking lot, where you at least have some time to see and react to kids/people quickly backing out/etc.

    In any event, thanks for the add’l info.

    #925286
    Tim Kelley
    Participant

    Here are two more detailed responses on the overall project:

    “A rehabilitation project is currently underway at the Memorial Plaza of Theodore Roosevelt Island. The project started in early December, 2010, and is projected to be completed in June, 2011. This project will consist of a rehabilitation of the piping system as well as some aesthetic improvements to the moats and fountains. As part of the project work, the contractor will periodically have heavy equipment and vehicles accessing the island on the pedestrian bridge during the weekdays. When crossing, the contractor is required to provide flaggers at both ends of the bridge.

    We know where the entrance to the bridge is located next to the Memorial parking lot is a congested area for bicyclists, pedestrians, and now, construction vehicles. Our maintenance folks have placed the orange and white plastic jersey barriers, you may have seen, along the edge of the Mount Vernon Trail near the bridge entrance. The purpose is to physically separate bridge traffic, especially construction vehicles, from the trail traffic. There are permanent bicycle racks with spaces between them that are located to the side of the bridge entrance. They have been blocked off with portable bicycle racks covered with plastic orange fencing to keep people from cutting through the permanent bicycle rack spaces to get on the trail and possibly colliding with any of the construction traffic. The contractor will also be setting up some temporary measures in the parking lot, so bicyclists can mount the curbs better.

    We know there is a long-standing trail crossing safety issue in the Memorial parking lot, too. Bicyclists coming from the Rosslyn area and going down the corkscrew walkway to the Mount Vernon Trail and heading on south typically use the center of the parking lot to go from the trail end on the river side of the parking lot and cross the lot over to the Mount Vernon Trail end on the Parkway side. We are working on some design ideas to improve the ease and safety of the bicycle crossing, so it doesn’t conflict with vehicles in the parking lot and pedestrians who are heading toward the island bridge entrance. The entire Theodore Roosevelt Island bridge and parking lot area is very small, cramped between the Parkway and Potomac River, so there’s not much room for a lot of stuff. We have some pretty innovative architects and engineers though who I think can ultimately figure something out.”

    AND:

    “The George Washington Memorial Parkway has a major construction repair project at the Teddy Roosevelt Memorial on the Island with a contractor staging area in the Parking Area. We are concerned about bicycle/ vehicle safety, especially near the west end of Pedestrian Bridge to Theodore Roosevelt Island which is being used by construction vehicles on weekdays (with flaggers stationed at both ends of bridge). An eastbound vehicle on the bridge is forced to make a nearly blind right turn into South Parking Lot because of shrubs screening the view.This is why we deployed the orange and white plastic Jersey barriers along the Mt Vernon Trail.

    The parking area for Teddy Roosevelt Island has North and South lots with the Mount Vernon Trail on west side of South lot and east (River) side of North lot. The Mt Vernon Trail crosses the parking from west to east sides with curb ramps and an at grade crosswalk at north end of South lot, which requires bicyclists to make two sharp right angle turns. Also, the paving of the Mount Vernon Trail on River side near North end of South lot is restricted by tree wells and is broken up by tree roots. To make the Mount Vernon Trail easier and safer for bicyclists to use during construction, we are considering temporarily deploying a curb-high speed table diagonal trail crossing of the vehicle travel road between the North and South parking lots, which would avoid the curb ramps, right angle turns and trail paving problem areas.

    The Park is also concerned about possible vehicle/ bicycle accidents from vehicles backing into bicyclists traversing the Parking area, especially on crowded weekends. If the temporary speed table for Mount Vernon Trail crossing proves to be effective, we will consider making it more permanent (or possibly relocating the at grade crossing), to make the area safer and easier for bicyclists on the Mount Vernon Trail.

    Thanks for your patience during the contruction, which will run through the end of June!”

    #925288
    Just161
    Participant

    Wow, this is a very thoughtful, reasonable answer, with good information so we can understand the situation. They got it right about the parking lot, and I’m glad to hear that the project is short-lived and they’re looking for a permanent solution. Kudos to whoever this came from (NPS?), and thanks to BikeArlington for sending it along.

    #925294
    leteng
    Participant

    @OneEighth 2765 wrote:

    I can see the sense in moving traffic away from the pedestrian bridge—having the path cross the parking lot isn’t ideal, but it does make sense if your goal is to minimize construction costs and save parking spots rather than to make the path user-friendly and safer.
    From a path users perspective, what doesn’t make sense is the transition across the parking lot. 90 degree turns aren’t realistic or safe in this instance. The problem is that the path is competing with parking—they could make a better, safer turn but that would loose a parking spot.
    On balance, the better design would involve shifting the entire parking area closer to the Parkway and continuing the path long the river. An added expense, obviously.
    I hear you, Pete…

    Yes, 90 degrees is not realistic, what do you think is the most conformtable angle for a regular biker (15 mph) to turn?

    #925941
    JorgeGortex
    Participant

    The real problem with this area, and what the NPS won’t fix, is the corkscrew bridge. It should never have been built this way. It should have been a smooth sweep from the top down onto a trail just past the entrance to the parking lot. This would have allowed all pedestrian, and bike traffic to avoid the parking lot all together. Instead they have to figure out how to make a very non-ideal area safer and easier. Not likely.

    Do the smart thing: rebuild the bridge and forget stop gap fixes. As bike commuting continues to increase this will become even more critical and area to have working smoothly and safely.

    #926132
    Dirt
    Participant

    As Daffy Duck would say, “We’ve got a new thpeed bump.”

    5757689307_4c3e97c3e5_b.jpg

    #926134
    Mark Blacknell
    Participant

    My generous take (which I don’t think is deserved, in light of this) is that they’re trying to slow down traffic as it approaches what they think to be the crossing point of the MVT.

    #926139
    bArlington
    Participant

    Oh wow do I really need to page attention to these forums. I fear this is all my fault!

    Before the temp jersey barriers went up at the head of the Island bridge, I was involved in a near miss with construction traffic. One truck was parked in the curb cut at the south end of the parking lot, another truck was coming across the bridge which I could not see. I went around the parked truck in the curb cut, up on the path, and was almost hit by the truck coming across the bridge. I jammed on my brakes. He jammed on his brakes. We looked at each other. Then he continued on swinging wide, onto the bike path, over the curb and into the parking lot — “WAIT, dude! You still didnt yield to me.” I contacted the GW NPS and not long after that the barriers were erected. They are sub optimal – but at least they create physical separation between the trucks and the bikes – and at least the trucks can no longer drive on the bike path itself.

    Last week I tweeted on BTWD that the Potomac had flooded its banks and there was water on the GW bike path. The NPS solution was to close the path. We are talking about 1″ of water and the busiest biking day of the year. Brain. Dead.

    So now we have a speed bump. Had this speed bump been placed say 10 feet to the south, south of the cross walk, the impact on bikers would have been minimal. Those in the souther half of the lot could bike around it. Those in the norther half of the lot would not have to stop at it to hit the curb cut onto the path. Those on the path coming from the south would not have an additional tight 90 degree turn onto the sidewalk.

    I talked to the park ranger about this, this morning. While I expressed my concern, we sat and watched a recumbent bike fail to navigate the 90 degree turn onto the sidewalk.

    I am glad to see the post from the NPS and see that there has been some interaction. But todays events prove again that the GW NPS seem indifferent to the concerns of the major bike path that cuts through their park.

Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 143 total)
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