Missed connection

[jabberwocky]

@ebubar 62618 wrote:

From now on it looks like i’ll get good at climbing and just brave the hills of Military Road on my way to Chain Bridge from now on, but this seriously shows me why more people don’t bike. If you follow the law, you’ll get hit. If you follow what’s safe, you’ll get ticketed (potentially).

Thats some bulls**t. Definitely report him and try and have a talk with someone at the department, because thats not in line with the laws of Virginia and doesn’t sound very professional either.

I’ve reported several drivers over the years and talked to several Fairfax County officers, and they have all understood proper lane positioning and been supportive of taking the lane where not doing so would be unsafe. Dunno of Arlington is just behind the times when it comes to cycling or you just got one of their assholes, but definitely follow up on it.

[Tim Kelley]

@jabberwocky 62625 wrote:

Dunno of Arlington is just behind the times when it comes to cycling…

The higher ups get it. I think it’s a matter of having the correct information trickle down the ranks.

[Mark Blacknell]

@ebubar 62618 wrote:

Missed connection from the Fiat 500 on North Glebe Road a little north of Marymount University. Luckily a cop saw the whole thing (or so I thought). He pulled me over for not hugging the curb while i’m riding. When I hug the curb cars don’t give me any space when passing and try to squeeze through. I tried to explain this to him, but he wouldn’t hear any of it. I tried to clarify what I should do, but he just wanted to lecture me. I may look like a 20 year old college kid joy-riding on my bike, but i’m a 30 year old professor of astrophysics trying to get to work. Treat me with some respect and have a conversation with me so I can clarify what you expect me to do. This is a 4 lane road (2 each way). It is unsafe for me to hug the right curb since it encourages cars to be in the lane with me. I ride far enough to the left (about 1/3 into the lane) that if they want to pass me they should use the left lane. This seems reasonable to me for the low traffic times that I plan my commutes. I’m riding in a position that I deem as safe (according to VA’s bike laws, “Bicyclists operating a bicycle on a roadway at less than the normal speed of traffic at the time and place under conditions then existing shall ride as close as safely practicable to the right curb or edge of roadway.”) and i’m not impeding traffic since they can get around me.

I really don’t think I was in the wrong here. Its consistent with the REI cycling skills course I took (I think). Happily he just gave me a warning, but the comment “these roads are dangerous enough without you people on them” was uncalled for.

From now on it looks like i’ll get good at climbing and just brave the hills of Military Road on my way to Chain Bridge from now on, but this seriously shows me why more people don’t bike. If you follow the law, you’ll get hit. If you follow what’s safe, you’ll get ticketed (potentially).

The situation, as you describe it, puts the ACPD officer in the wrong. I would follow up with both ACPD Chief Doug Scott’s office, as well as let the County Board know that your experience with the ACPD as a cyclist is discouraging. Let us know what you hear back.

(Careful, though – it was an encounter with a similarly uninformed ACPD officer years ago that kicked me into high gear when it comes to cycling advocacy.)

[dasgeh]

@ebubar 62624 wrote:

It was a verbal warning only, so no badge number. I was so shocked that I got pulled over, my wits escaped me. I was questioning if I was even legally in the right.

Even so, I urge you to report it. ACPD should know which officer was there at that time, and even if they don’t, they’ll know what district and take it up with the proper command.

In a perfect world, you’d write a letter to powers that be (ACPD command, County board members), but I know that’s a lot to ask.

You were a vulnerable road user, following every law, keeping yourself safe. You were unsafely passed by someone who was not in a vulnerable position. On top of that, someone in a position of authority chided you with incorrect interpretations of the law. It’s completely reasonable for you to feel shaken and even doubt yourself. But that officer’s actions were unacceptable, and having police act that way puts all cyclists in danger.

I have heard some representatives of ACPD speak in ways that makes me think they get it. So I don’t think it’s all of ACPD that’s anti-cyclist. So I’m hopeful that a letter could really lead to that officer (and hopefully all officers) getting a talking to.

[MRH5028]

@Tim Kelley 62627 wrote:

The higher ups get it. I think it’s a matter of having the correct information trickle down the ranks.

Do you know if there is any sort of cycling centric training provided for ACPD etc?

[Tim Kelley]

@MRH5028 62631 wrote:

Do you know if there is any sort of cycling centric training provided for ACPD etc?

I haven’t heard of anything specifically, but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist.

[consularrider]

@ebubar 62624 wrote:

It was a verbal warning only, so no badge number. I was so shocked that I got pulled over, my wits escaped me. I was questioning if I was even legally in the right.

He was so wrong in so many ways, but mostly because for almost all of its entire length Glebe Road has inadequate lane width for a cyclist to safefully share the right hand lane with any four wheeled plus motor vehicle, even a Fiat 500. Therefore the exception to FRAP contained in VDOT’s Bicycing and Walking guide should apply.

[jabberwocky]

@ebubar 62624 wrote:

It was a verbal warning only, so no badge number. I was so shocked that I got pulled over, my wits escaped me. I was questioning if I was even legally in the right.

For reference, the relevant Virginia code:

http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+46.2-905

Any person operating a bicycle, electric personal assistive mobility device, electric power-assisted bicycle, or moped on a roadway at less than the normal speed of traffic at the time and place under conditions then existing shall ride as close as safely practicable to the right curb or edge of the roadway, except under any of the following circumstances:

1. When overtaking and passing another vehicle proceeding in the same direction;

2. When preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway;

3. When reasonably necessary to avoid conditions including, but not limited to, fixed or moving objects, parked or moving vehicles, pedestrians, animals, surface hazards, or substandard width lanes that make it unsafe to continue along the right curb or edge;

4. When avoiding riding in a lane that must turn or diverge to the right; and

5. When riding upon a one-way road or highway, a person may also ride as near the left-hand curb or edge of such roadway as safely practicable.

For purposes of this section, a “substandard width lane” is a lane too narrow for a bicycle, electric personal assistive mobility device, electric power-assisted bicycle, motorized skateboard or foot-scooter, or moped and another vehicle to pass safely side by side within the lane.

(bolds mine).

Another relevant section:

http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+46.2-839

Any driver of any vehicle overtaking a bicycle, electric personal assistive mobility device, electric power-assisted bicycle, moped, animal, or animal-drawn vehicle proceeding in the same direction shall pass at a reasonable speed at least two feet to the left of the overtaken bicycle, electric personal assistive mobility device, electric power-assisted bicycle, moped, animal, or animal-drawn vehicle and shall not again proceed to the right side of the highway until safely clear of such overtaken bicycle, electric personal assistive mobility device, electric power-assisted bicycle, moped, animal, or animal-drawn vehicle.

Basically, if a lane is too narrow that a car cannot give you the legal-mandated two feet of clear room without leaving the lane (which is very common), there is no legal requirement that you stay to the right at all.

Even when the lane is wide enough, the requirement that you stay right has exceptions for road debris and unsafe conditions. And even beyond that, the code doesn’t say as far right as possible, it says as far right as practicable .

So that officer was completely wrong, ignorant, and was basically making the law up on the spot.

[OneEighth]

Alternately, you could go have a talk with a member or two of the county board who are into the whole ‘bike friendly community’ thing and ask them to put you in touch with someone at Arlington PD who understands that this behavior was off-message and is able to take department-wide corrective action.

[dasgeh]

@Tim Kelley 62635 wrote:

I haven’t heard of anything specifically, but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist.

I’ve asked a number of times in a number of forums. Generally the answer is that ACPD officers get the standard training for Virginia Police. So I’d go with no.

[mstone]

@jabberwocky 62615 wrote:

Trail ninja! The single reason I ran an 800 lumen light on the W&OD when I commuted that way. A lot probably don’t really think about. I talked to many over the years while commuting and most just seemed to not care. I’d say I couldn’t see them very well and they should consider a blinky or reflective vest, and get a “meh” at best.

At least you can often see disembodied shoes jogging along, since running shoes tend to have some sort of scotchlite built in! But yes, that’s the source of my comment the other day on the “what kind of light” topic: you need something bright enough to identify hazards far enough in advance to react. So a light bright enough to see a non-reflective hazard something on the order of at least 15-20 feet away at 10MPH and 30-50 feet away at 20MPH. On the deep dark trails that includes the woods on either side of the path, where critters sometimes jump out or branches protrude. (That is, beam pattern is just as important as lumens, and something that throws a spotlight 100ft down the trail and leaves the foreground dark is just as useless as something that can’t throw a light more than 10ft.)

[dasgeh]

@OneEighth 62639 wrote:

Alternately, you could go have a talk with a member or two of the county board who are into the whole ‘bike friendly community’ thing and ask them to put you in touch with someone at Arlington PD who understands that this behavior was off-message and is able to take department-wide corrective action.

I would be happy to go with you. Seriously.

[Terpfan]

I was showing a coworker the route in this morning from OT into our office and passed a jogger and a few feet later encountered one coming the opposite direction who said to us, “you need to yell your passes.” Of course, said jogger had his earphones in and didn’t hear my three loud rings for the jogger I had just passed or my coworker saying left as he passed the person. Kudos to my coworker for not missing a beat saying, “and you need to take your headphones out so you can actually hear us.”

[TwoWheelsDC]

@consularrider 62637 wrote:

He was so wrong in so many ways, but mostly because for almost all of its entire length Glebe Road has inadequate lane width for a cyclist to safefully share the right hand lane with any four wheeled plus motor vehicle, even a Fiat 500. Therefore the exception to FRAP contained in VDOT’s Bicycing and Walking guide should apply.

I’ve never quite understood why Glebe is four lanes between Lee and Military. Make it two lanes with bike lanes, and maybe dedicated left turn lanes instead. I doubt it would affect traffic at all in that section, as the only place I see any real concentration of cars is at Chain Bridge and the light at Lee Hwy.

[papalena]

@ebubar 62618 wrote:

I really don’t think I was in the wrong here. Its consistent with the REI cycling skills course I took (I think). Happily he just gave me a warning, but the comment “these roads are dangerous enough without you people on them” was uncalled for.

From now on it looks like i’ll get good at climbing and just brave the hills of Military Road on my way to Chain Bridge from now on, but this seriously shows me why more people don’t bike. If you follow the law, you’ll get hit. If you follow what’s safe, you’ll get ticketed (potentially).

First, I’ll echo the sentiment that you have every right not to have to hug the right edge of the road. It isn’t because of bikers that “these roads are dangerous enough”, it’s because of those people in the two-ton vehicles.

Secondly, I’ll put in a plug for a better way (my favorite) to get from Marymount (I live just south of there) to Chain Bridge, which takes you through the scenic neighborhood streets, but avoids most of Glebe and the hills on Military. (There is one short hill here, on Dittmar just before Old Glebe, but it’s short (~800 ft) and not bad especially if you keep your momentum from the downhill just before it). Plus, you pretty much don’t have to pedal until that short hill. The route:

1. Head northwest on N Glebe Rd toward N Rock Spring Rd, 0.2 mi
2. Turn right onto N Rock Spring Rd, 56 ft
3. Turn left onto 32nd St N , 0.1 mi
4. Turn left onto N Albemarle St, 0.3 mi
5. Turn right onto N Dittmar Rd, 0.8 mi
6. Turn right onto N Old Glebe Rd, 0.5 mi
7. Continue onto Military Rd, 0.1 mi
8. Turn left onto N Randolph St, 0.2 mi
9. Turn right toward Chain Bridge Rd [41st St], 0.2 mi
10. Slight left toward Chain Bridge Rd, 312 ft
11. Turn right onto Chain Bridge Rd, 23 ft
12. Turn left onto Chain Bridge, 285 ft

The link in google maps would be https://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=Marymount+University,+North+Glebe+Road,+Arlington,+VA&daddr=38.9140763,-77.1320915+to:Chain+Bridge,+Washington+DC&hl=en&ll=38.916715,-77.125568&spn=0.029851,0.031972&sll=38.918351,-77.129388&sspn=0.029851,0.031972&geocode=FcCmUQIdBB5n-yGSBVqc2z2ZPCkf8NKzzbW3iTGSBVqc2z2ZPA%3BFRzIUQIdxQ5n-ymzgoMyvLW3iTGbQ0MhoCQOgQ%3BFVYEUgIdekpn-yHCsSV7HJ4XCynNeruu8LW3iTHCsSV7HJ4XCw&dirflg=b&mra=dpe&mrsp=1&sz=15&via=1&t=m&z=15&lci=bike

[Author]

Posts