[aaronwelsh]

What is the rationale behind this requirement?

[aaronwelsh]

@LhasaCM 169140 wrote:

Another drawback to that idea is that – holding weather constant – it rewards those able to ride when others aren’t.

Well those who can devote a ton of hours, and those who can ride during daylight hours, will have a big advantage no matter what scoring system we use. Not sure we should use that as a knock against any particular methodology.

[aaronwelsh]

Here’s a potential spin on “Steve O’s crazy idea”: suppose every day there was a fixed number of points that was up for grabs each day. I don’t know what scale would make sense, given the other points that might be floating around, but to demonstrate the concept let’s say 1200 points per day. These would be allocated to each rider based on their total miles for that day: (1200 / total FS miles ridden that day) * (number of miles that the rider contributed to the total)

So on a really nice day maybe FS riders are all out riding and rack up 3600 miles total… they will each earn 1/3rd of a point per mile, in addition to whatever other points they’re earning.

On the worst day of the year, perhaps only 150 miles total get ridden. On that day, each mile will earn you (1200/150)=9 bonus points per mile.

The main drawback will be that riders traveling to warm climates will skew the distribution. Perhaps you are only eligible for these points if you’re riding near DC.

[aaronwelsh]

@LhasaCM 169093 wrote:

True numerically – but since there many ways to get the same general effect, perception is important.

Yep – those formulas are just like income tax brackets (rate a applies up to here, rate b applies to the next range, etc.) I think I realized this morning that I’m way too interested in the thought experiment just because I haven’t worked that part of my brain enough in quite a few years, which also means it’ll take me a while to work to the “here’s the simple version of the complicated thing I threw out there”.

And also – I’m not necessarily advocating for anything. I’m not going to win where something more than 3 miles counts regardless, so I’m just tossing things against the wall to see if anything sticks since there seemed to be some interest in a change.

Since we’re cyclists, perhaps it makes sense to think of it as a “breakaway headwind.” It makes it easier for small-miles participants to stay with the peloton. It makes it somewhat more difficult for the large-miles cyclists to go off the front.

It’s certainly a fair question whether that’s what we want. FS has always rewarded consistency with points. These schemes would increase the incentive for low-milage participants to up their miles (since they won’t simply get a first-mile bonus), with the downside of reducing the incentive for the high-milage cyclists to ride further. Since there are far more low-milage participants, and since FS is a community activity, I think this may be an improvement.

I suspect that the high-milage riders are more interested in who rides the furthest, rather than who earn the most points. To that end, we should probably let individuals compete on pure mileage, while teams will compete on points. (Maybe that’s already what we do?)

[aaronwelsh]

@Bob James 169087 wrote:

Diminishing returns appears to directly penalize for riding more. Riding a century in sub-freezing weather (add in wet conditions) is pretty miserable and often necessary for those living farther away for commutes and attending events. Adding bonus points is a direct reward and encourages daily riding and can accomplish similar “leveraging” results without giving the appearance of being punitive. Accelerating returns seems more positive and encouraging than diminishing returns.

Below is an example, of accelerating returns/points. At first it appears no difference in point spread, but if that century rider skips a day of riding and a daily rider does 10 miles, they would gain 65 points on the sporadic century rider (and more importantly team points). Again, with the theory that daily riding for most will also translate into more participation, such as convoys, social events, Strava titles, pointless prize competing, forum posts, etc…

[ATTACH=CONFIG]15807[/ATTACH]

If someone rides at least 10 miles a day, there is no loss of points, i.e. no penalty for riding more, but was dramatically encouraged to ride daily by the scoring system. It would be very difficult to voluntarily forfeit up to 55 bonus points just because it was sub-freezing temps and/or wet conditions.

I think “losing points” and “being penalized” are not the right way to think about it. More miles will always equate to more points, just the rate of point accumulation will change as you ride.

[aaronwelsh]

I’m in! Looking forward to meeting everyone

[Author]

Posts