Working with the NPS GWMP on snow removal – comments by 2 March

[bentbike33]

@dbb 135746 wrote:

Aren’t we all scofflaws?

To paraphrase Al Gore, just say that you did nothing wrong but won’t do it again. Mention controlling legal authority as well.

It’s only funny until the first mass arrest for criminal trespass and destruction of federal property (i.e., snow cover).

[dbb]

Any chance the ever-present Canada Geese that are along the MVT could somehow be pressed into service to do snow removal (or anything else useful)?

[mstone]

@bentbike33 135749 wrote:

It’s only funny until the first mass arrest for criminal trespass and destruction of federal property (i.e., snow cover).

Civil disobedience is a time honored American tradition.

[BlueMasonJar]

Sorry, I didn’t mean to point fingers or anything

[dasgeh]

@BlueMasonJar 135741 wrote:

What’s the deal with volunteering to clear? Would they let people clear a critical path with hand tools?

I ask just cuz one immediate solution might be some kind of volunteer agreement. I for one, would not be above showing up and shoveling rather than waiting for someone to plough. I say that as someone relatively new to this discussion.

Just curious if this was raised in any discussion.

So more seriously, we’re talking about fairly long stretches, many of which aren’t very accessible, and we need reliability. I don’t see volunteers hand clearing sections as a solution.

[dbb]

@BlueMasonJar 135756 wrote:

Sorry, I didn’t mean to point fingers or anything

No offense was perceived or taken. There will certainly be opportunities for volunteer efforts but those are likely to be small areas or for extraordinary circumstances.

[BlueMasonJar]

Glad no one took offense.

All I wanted to say really was – how can volunteers play a role & I am willing to shovel.

[Emm]

@Rootchopper 135653 wrote:

For those of us who commute from south of the Beltway to DC and North Arlington, plowing from Tulane Drive makes the most sense. There is no safe passage across the GW Parkway at Belle View/Belle Haven at rush hour. Moreover to get to that point many bike commuters would have to ride on Fort Hunt Road which is definitely not prefered. FHR already lacks shoulders in many places, a condition made worse when snow clogs the edge of the roadway. Plowing and treating the trail from Tulane Drive is the better because it keeps bikes off Fort Hunt Road at rush hour. Most of Mount Vernon north of Little Hunting Creek can use side streets to get to Tulane.

I second Rootchoppers recommendation. You can use safe side streets from the Fort Hunt/north of Little Hunting Creek area to get to Tulane, but past Tulane there is no safe access point to the trail, and Fort Hunt can be dangerous to bike on during a good day.

If needed due to budget constraints, you could do Tulane to Old Town, and then pick back up at the 4MRT, or in Crystal City. There are plowed paths and streets from Old town to those areas, but they definitely require going out of your way to access them.

[Rootchopper]

heaven forbid that drivers have to “go out of their way”. Bicyclists shouldn’t be held to a different standard.

[qwerty]

With respect to funding, shifting existing resources that are being used inefficiently should permit snow clearing on the trail. Within 24 hours after storms end, all of the parking lots along the GWP are typically scoured clear of snow and treated. Since it is the middle of winter and recreational drivers are few when the area is inundated with snow, the only people using the parking lots are the taxi drivers using the port-a-johns. Yet every square inch of the lots is cleared. The snow from the the parking lots and the Parkway is typically dumped on the path. In some years when there have been long periods below freezing, snow and ice remain on the path for a month, especially in shadowed areas like overpasses. A more practical, useful approach would be to first clear the path, since there are toilets all over that taxi drivers can use, but winter cyclists have almost no practical alternatives. One mini truck with a snow plow could clear and salt the MVT in about as much time as is spent clearing the parking lots.

[dbb]

bentbike33;135603 wrote:

remove the snow fences at the approaches to the humpback bridge

success!!!!!

[bentbike33]

@bentbike33 135603 wrote:

Let’s start with some preventive measures that should cost very little and speed access via melting to the MVT after a snow event, to wit:

1. Remove the snow fences at the approaches to the Humpback Bridge and any other snow fences adjacent to the trail. They make things worse. Snow fences may make sense in wide-open areas of the MVT like Gravelly Point, but they need to be placed well back from the trail to be effective.

2. Do not dump snow cleared from adjacent facilities onto the MVT.

Thanks to dbb, the snow fences are gone from the approaches to the Humpback Bridge. May the Humpback Glacier recede into the dim mists of ancient lore!

[mstone]

@qwerty 135897 wrote:

With respect to funding, shifting existing resources that are being used inefficiently should permit snow clearing on the trail.

It isn’t clear that’s actually true. Is there an actual analysis of how much can be saved by rewriting the existing snow removal contract (are the lots broken out separately or is it basically a throw-in for doing everything else)? Is there an analysis of how much it would cost to acquire the trail clearing capability that doesn’t already exist? There’s a difference between a back of the envelope estimate of how much it would cost me to drive down a trail in a bobcat and the end result of the government procurement process.

[dbb]

@mstone 135902 wrote:

Is there an actual analysis of how much can be saved by rewriting the existing snow removal contract

In our conversation with the NPS the other day, I don’t recall them saying they are using any contractors. I think the NPS effort is all in-house.

[KWL]

@dbb 135898 wrote:

success!!!!!

Proof.

[Author]

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