Woman Hit by Cyclist on Four Mile Run

[Trollopian]

There have been quite a few remarks about this victim’s “randomness” or “failure to follow rules.” I have no idea whether she suffered from hearing loss or from age-related delays in response time, or was a non-native English speaker, but please remember that there are many such people and they have a perfect right to be on the sidewalk or path. I myself wear two hearing aids and am slow to hear the standard “On your left!” yell….in fact, I have to turn to lip-read. Please have compassion. If there is a pedestrian ahead of you, do not assume that he or she knows “the rules.” When you are sharing the road, the right thing to do is slow down so that you could not cause injury in the event of a collision.

[PotomacCyclist]

@KLizotte 22069 wrote:

I fully agree that there are not enough signs on the MUPs (Gravelly Pt is a very egregious example). Everyone playing by the same rules will only occur if everyone knows them first.

At least the NPS may be separating bike and pedestrian traffic at Gravelly Point in the near future.

[MCL1981]

@Trollopian 22084 wrote:

When you are sharing the road, the right thing to do is slow down so that you could not cause injury in the event of a collision.

This is impractical and unreasonable. Hitting a pedestrian with a moving bicycle is going to knock both of you over regardless and both are going to get hurt. Assume a walking pace of 3mph. So you want everyone to slow down to 4mph to pass every pedestrian?? Sorry. Not happening. If someone is going to do something to cause a terrible accident, then there is nothing you, I, or anyone else can do about it.

[mstone]

@Trollopian 22084 wrote:

There have been quite a few remarks about this victim’s “randomness” or “failure to follow rules.” I have no idea whether she suffered from hearing loss or from age-related delays in response time, or was a non-native English speaker, but please remember that there are many such people and they have a perfect right to be on the sidewalk or path. I myself wear two hearing aids and am slow to hear the standard “On your left!” yell….in fact, I have to turn to lip-read. Please have compassion. If there is a pedestrian ahead of you, do not assume that he or she knows “the rules.” When you are sharing the road, the right thing to do is slow down so that you could not cause injury in the event of a collision.

The counterpoint that has been made several times is that it might not be possible to slow down enough to not cause injury if someone does something unexpected and collides with you; this same thing could conceivably happened between two pedestrians. We simply do not know the speed of the cyclist involved or where the two people were positioned and how they moved at the time of the accident.

Most cyclists are cautious around pedestrians. (Yes, there are also jerks–the population of jerks in any subset of humanity is probably fairly constant.) But no matter how cautious cyclists are, pedestrians also need to take some responsibility not to move unpredictably across a multi-use path without looking. Always move to the right and off the path when stopping or turning, especially if you don’t know whether there’s someone right behind you due to a hearing or other impairment. There aren’t just cyclists out there–you might also have a jogger, rollerblader, stroller, etc. coming at you. Odds are that none of those things will actually be a problem at any given time, but someone does win the lottery every week, and every once in a while low-probability accidents turn tragic.

[jnva]

@MCL1981 22094 wrote:

This is impractical and unreasonable. Hitting a pedestrian with a moving bicycle is going to knock both of you over regardless and both are going to get hurt. Assume a walking pace of 3mph. So you want everyone to slow down to 4mph to pass every pedestrian?? Sorry. Not happening. If someone is going to do something to cause a terrible accident, then there is nothing you, I, or anyone else can do about it.

I have had people jump in front of me many many times, and i have never hit anyone becuase yes, I slow down to just above walking speed when passing people. especially elderly and young kids.

You have the right to go whatever speed you want, I prefer to make sure I dont hit someone.

[eminva]

@MCL1981 22094 wrote:

This is impractical and unreasonable. Hitting a pedestrian with a moving bicycle is going to knock both of you over regardless and both are going to get hurt. Assume a walking pace of 3mph. So you want everyone to slow down to 4mph to pass every pedestrian?? Sorry. Not happening.

Well, this is what I do, on the Custis and the W&OD, everyday. I don’t necessarily slow down all the way to 4 mph every time, but I always slow down and sometimes I slow down to a walking pace (especially if there is oncoming traffic; I always wait for that to pass). I still get to work in about an hour and get home in an hour and 15 (14 miles each way). I don’t find it impractical or unreasonable.

Liz

[MCL1981]

I cruise along the 5-8 mile downgrade portion of the CCT about 18mph in the morning. Along that stretch, I pass peds in both directions. I pass them wide, all the way over to the side of the far lane. With 2-3 or more bell dings from a very far out distance when overtaking. Burning off speed from 18mph down to a walking pace to crawl passed every single pedestrian is completely unreasonable, unneccessary, and impractical. I would be burning through brakes, burning through my legs, and burning through the clock for absolutely no reason or functional benefit. In fact, it is more likely to CAUSE an accident cyclists behind me end up doing something silly because this ridiculous maneuver.

What I do not do is “shoot the gap”… passing in the middle of two way traffic. I slow down and wait for the oncoming lane to be clear. Unlike some people… ok unlike a lot of people… I don’t mind slowing down to allow this to happen.

[KLizotte]

It would certainly be useful and safer if the peds acknowledged the warning with a handwave.

[5555624]

@KLizotte 22123 wrote:

It would certainly be useful and safer if the peds acknowledged the warning with a handwave.

Some (mostly runners?) do and that’s the only time I assume that my bell and call out has been heard. Otherwise, even if I see them move to the right, I assume they have not heard me and slow down even more.

[KLizotte]

The scary takeaway from this incident is the fact that this could happen to any of us whenever we are out biking. We all pass peds (while calling or ringing) and there is no telling when a ped (or even another cyclist) is going to do something unpredictable and become seriously hurt as a result. Any one of us could have been involved in a serious accident at Sunday’s Crystal Ride for instance.

It is quite possible (probable?) that the cyclist in this incident is going to be hit with a very expensive and protracted civil lawsuit from the deceased family. It is rather alarming to read how many people are calling for a civil lawsuit on the various news websites. Given the litigious nature of our culture, I’d be more surprised if it didn’t happen. If someone mistakenly put me in a wheelchair for life, I can’t say with my hand on my heart that I wouldn’t sue too. Even if the cyclist in this accident wins the case in civil court, you can be assured his life savings will be wiped out in the process. One is better off being in an accident in a car; there are more laws defining rights and responsibilities and your insurance provides a small buffer.

Anybody know if personal liability insurance would protect one in incidents like these?

[dasgeh]

Biking south on the Custis this morning, 3 peds came out of a particularly blind walkway (I think it was the walkway that continues from Pierce Street? It was between Quinn and Oak). The first didn’t pause or looked, just stepped out on the trail, looking down in his coffee, talking to his friends. I was headed downhill, but being my conservative self, I was riding my breaks. Had I been going full speed, the guy would have probably walked right into me or in front of me, and I wouldn’t have had time to stop. As is, I had time to slow down enough, to yell, stopping ped #3, and to swerve around #1 and #2 enough to avoid an accident.

So is there a sign or anything for the peds coming on to the trail? I think they’re coming off of stairs, and there is a fence narrowing both their path and their sight lines. Seems like a horrible idea to have on the downhill, protected part of the trail.

[invisiblehand]

@KLizotte 22068 wrote:

What I mean by “transportation corridor” is the reasonable expectation that traffic (on wheels, peds, etc) will be moving on it and that people have to act accordingly; that is, users should always expect traffic to pass them occasionally and that everyone is part of a continually moving traffic stream. We do not expect, or condone, people having a picnic in the middle of the trail, or kids playing hopscotch, etc. Likewise, if I have to change a tire, I move off the trail because I am impeding traffic. MUP users have to think just like they do as drivers – which is keep things moving and stay out of each others’ way. If I’m doing 55 on the beltway I stay in the right lane for instance.

OK. Then it sounds like our expectations agree.

[DOS]

@KLizotte 22175 wrote:

The scary takeaway from this incident is the fact that this could happen to any of us whenever we are out biking. We all pass people (while calling passes) and there is no telling when a ped (or even another cyclist) is going to do something unpredictable and become seriously hurt as a result. Any one of us could have been involved in a serious accident at Sunday’s Crystal Ride for instance.

It is quite possible (probable?) that the cyclist in this incident is going to be hit with a very expensive and protracted civil lawsuit from the deceased family. It is rather alarming to read how many people are calling for a civil lawsuit on the various news websites. Given the litigious nature of our culture, I’d be more surprised if it didn’t happen. If someone mistakenly put me in a wheelchair for life, I can’t say with my hand on my heart that I wouldn’t sue too. Even if the cyclist in this accident wins the case in civil court, you can be assured his life savings will be wiped out in the process. One is better off being in an accident in a car; there are more laws defining rights and responsibilities and your insurance provides a small buffer.

Anybody know if personal liability insurance would protect one in incidents like these?

This is why I have for the most part stopped using trails. One of cardinal rules I follow as a cyclist riding in traffic is to be predictable so the cars can anticipate what I might do. Pedestrians simply are not predicatable; while cars, to a much greater degree, are. They tend to stop at signs and lights, signal tuirns, etc (not always, of course). What it comes down to is that, because I am significantly less confident in my ability to anticpate the behavior of pedestrians than I am of automobile traffic , I am way more afraid of running into and injuring/being injured by a pedestrian than I am of getting hit by a car.

[jnva]

@DOS 22219 wrote:

This is why I have for the most part stopped using trails. One of cardinal rules I follow as a cyclist riding in traffic is to be predictable so the cars can anticipate what I might do. Pedestrians simply are not predicatable; while cars, to a much greater degree, are. They tend to stop at signs and lights, signal tuirns, etc (not always, of course). What it comes down to is that, because I am significantly less confident in my ability to anticpate the behavior of pedestrians than I am of automobile traffic , I am way more afraid of running into and injuring/being injured by a pedestrian than I am of getting hit by a car.

Yep, I feel the same. That’s why I am so carefull on the trails but I try to stick to the roads as much as possible. Pedestrians step into the trail not realizing that it’s a “transportation corridor”. They don’t read this forum nor do they care about cyclists rights or rules. Most of them are just out for a walk and there’s nothing wrong with that.

[pfunkallstar]

@jnva 22246 wrote:

Yep, I feel the same. That’s why I am so carefull on the trails but I try to stick to the roads as much as possible. Pedestrians step into the trail not realizing that it’s a “transportation corridor”. They don’t read this forum nor do they care about cyclists rights or rules. Most of them are just out for a walk and there’s nothing wrong with that.

I had this exact conversation with a woman not too long ago who was out walking her dog with what appeared to be the world’s longest leash. I acknowledged my pass, very politely asked her to reel in her dog, and was greeted with a fusillade of nonsense – “I can use as much of the path as my dog needs!” Unfortunately we live in an increasingly urban space that people still treat like suburbs, streets and trails are pretty much equally dangerous nowadays.

[Author]

Posts