Why Are DC Area Cyclists the RUDEST I Have Ever Seen ?

[jrenaut]

In order to pass legally, the car must fully leave the lane, and only when the line is dotted. If the bikes are riding legally while the cars are driving illegally, I’m not sure how one could conclude that the cyclists are being rude.

[Roscoe]

@jrenaut 9923 wrote:

In order to pass legally, the car must fully leave the lane, and only when the line is dotted. If the bikes are riding legally while the cars are driving illegally, I’m not sure how one could conclude that the cyclists are being rude.

So according to this, on some of the roads where i live in MD near the DC border……..cars can NEVER legally pass cyclists, since they would always have to cross a double yellow line to do so ? That sure doesn’t seem to make a lot of sense to me. If that’s the case, as an avid cyclist myself I would strongly advocate forbidding cyclists from the road. Anyone ever seen Jones Mill Road on a weekend ? It’s pretty lame right now, the way the cyclists show no respect for the traffic. I can only imagine what it would be like with traffic backed up and slowed to 15 mph IF EVEN THAT for the entire day.

[Roscoe]

@rcannon100 9902 wrote:

……if I am riding on a road, I am going to take the full lane…….

Please don’t ever ride on a road near me.

I exercise extreme caution and courtesy towards the tremendous amount of cyclists riding near my home. I feel comfortable in expecting them in return to not to be rude while riding.

[jrenaut]

@Roscoe 9925 wrote:

So according to this, on some of the roads where i live in MD near the DC border……..cars can NEVER legally pass cyclists, since they would always have to cross a double yellow line to do so ? That sure doesn’t seem to make a lot of sense to me. If that’s the case, as an avid cyclist myself I would strongly advocate forbidding cyclists from the road. Anyone ever seen Jones Mill Road on a weekend ? It’s pretty lame right now, the way the cyclists show no respect for the traffic. I can only imagine what it would be like with traffic backed up and slowed to 15 mph IF EVEN THAT for the entire day.

Yes, it is always illegal to cross a double yellow line, even if you’re really really inconvenienced. You are free to advocate for forbidding all cyclists from the road – that’s one of the wonderful things about living in a democracy. But I think you’d be better off taking your own advice and learning to share the road.

[DismalScientist]

@Tim Kelley 9914 wrote:

The CC trail is downhill as you travel south–you probably see most of the people speeding in that direction.

Also: http://ballston.patch.com/articles/local-pathletes-pursue-championship-dreams

Tim: At least you stick to the streets for your Cat 6 races. :p

[jabberwocky]

@Roscoe 9926 wrote:

Please don’t ever ride on a road near me.

I exercise extreme caution and courtesy towards the tremendous amount of cyclists riding near my home. I feel comfortable in expecting them in return to not to be rude while riding.

Taking the lane is absolutely necessary for safety on some roads. It has nothing to do with being rude.

EDIT: You seem to be arguing that cyclists mere presence on the road is “rude”, because it sometimes holds drivers up. Am I misunderstanding you?

[DismalScientist]

In my recent (and very rare) driving excursion to Montgomery County last weekend, there were lots of cyclists about. Traffic was been slowed by them in general, but I don’t think they were doing anything unsafe or particularly rude. Except of course two riders abreast on a residential street that was a detour for route 127 (I think). Cars were backing up behind and could not pass in spite of no opposing traffic since the outer bike was near the non-existent center line. Since I bike more than I drive, I think I look at this from the cyclist’s perspective. These folks were rude.

I think folks are being too absolutist here. Sometimes riding abreast is reasonable and safe, in other times, not.

[DismalScientist]

@jrenaut 9923 wrote:

In order to pass legally, the car must fully leave the lane, and only when the line is dotted. If the bikes are riding legally while the cars are driving illegally, I’m not sure how one could conclude that the cyclists are being rude.

If this were true, it would be illegal to filter through traffic if the cars were moving at all.

[Roscoe]

@jrenaut 9928 wrote:

Yes, it is always illegal to cross a double yellow line, even if you’re really really inconvenienced. You are free to advocate for forbidding all cyclists from the road – that’s one of the wonderful things about living in a democracy. But I think you’d be better off taking your own advice and learning to share the road.

Oh, I think I’m quite good at sharing the road, regardless of what you might think. But sharing the road and being respectful towards the safety of others doesn’t mean one has to be pleased about the fact that so often they are doing it for people that don’t have the slightest concern for showing courtesy towards others.

So on the weekends when the roads near me are very full of both traffic and cyclists……. all the traffic passing the 2-abreast cycists is actually violating the law ? Thanks, I hadn’t known that. I can only imagine how inconvenient these roads would be if everyone followed that law.

As far as my right to democratically advocate something……thanks for pointing that out, though I was indeed well aware of that right. I guess I’m just different from you in that I would prefer people to voluntarily show others some courtesy instead of telling them to deal with my deliberate rudeness and go “advocate” a change if I didn’t like it.

[Roscoe]

@jabberwocky 9930 wrote:

You seem to be arguing that cyclists mere presence on the road is “rude”, because it sometimes holds drivers up. Am I misunderstanding you?

Indeed you are. I assure you that I’m on these roads on two wheels as much as many others here must be.

I’m saying that when I ride, I stick to the right of the lane as much as possible and try to show respect for traffic by making sharing as convenient for them as possible. Just like I show respect for the cyclists by not being too close and otherwise respecting their safety as much as possible.

What I’m saying is that it disgusts me that I see so many cyclists that I am absolutely convinced take the road with the deliberate intent to flex their ego by riding 2-abreast, and inconveniencing the traffic, when they could just as easily show others a little respect by riding single file to enable traffic to pass more easily.

[ronwalf]

@Roscoe 9926 wrote:

Please don’t ever ride on a road near me.

I have the Maryland DOT’s publication “Safe Bicycling in Maryland.” It says:

When to Ride in the Middle:
It’s safest to ride in the middle of the lane when:
(a) You’re moving at the speed of traffic; (b) the lane is too small for cars to pass you safely; (c) you’re avoiding potholes or the doors of parked cars

Since the state of Maryland says cyclists should be taking the lane on the roads described, and riding two abreast doesn’t change the passing dynamics, you are specifically advocating against the recommendation of experts.

[mstone]

@Roscoe 9920 wrote:

And it inconveniences the traffic more because they not only need a larger gap to make this longer pass, they frequently cannot judge the situation as well with their imperfect vision of the road caused by the cyclists riding abreast. Which obviously results in longer back-ups behind the cyclists. As does the fact that numerous motorists may lack the confidence to pass completely in the oncoming lane. Sure, you can say that those motorists SHOULD have greater skill and confidence….but with some of the poor drivers and elderly folks on the road, it’s just not the case.

I’d much rather have these uncertain and nervous drivers inconvenienced by having to slow down than to have them attempt a pass, chicken out when they see oncoming traffic, and hit the cyclist as they swerve back into their lane. That scenario is extremely common, which is why it is sometimes essential for the cyclist to position himself in the lane in a manner which precludes someone from “squeezing past”. Drivers tend to flatten the cyclist rather than risking a sideswipe by another car. There’s a difference between “courtesy” and self-preservation. If there’s not enough well-maintained shoulder to have an escape route on the right of the white line, the escape route needs to be the right several feet of the lane.

[Roscoe]

@ronwalf 9939 wrote:

Since the state of Maryland says cyclists should be taking the lane on the roads described, and riding two abreast doesn’t change the passing dynamics, you are specifically advocating against the recommendation of experts.

Not exactly.

First, most cyclists (at least right near me) are only moving “at the speed of traffic” because they have in fact slowed down the traffic. It’s clearly a very small minority of riders that maintains a pace at or near the posted speed limit.

Second, according to this definition, there are almost NO roads in the state (at least absolutely none that I’ve ever seen) in which a car can safely pass a bicycle without leaving the lane whatsoever. Is that not what would constitute a lane that is not large enough for cars to pass safely ?

So these rules are interesting. They’re kind of a self-fulfilling definition for the cyclists – bikes are entitled to the entire lane unless it’s somehow abnormally wide enough for cars to pass entirely within the same lane…..AND the slower bikes then dictate the pace and are thus ALWAYS moving at “the speed of traffic.”

I certainly won’t dispute that these rules you post are apparently factual. But neither can you dispute that following them as written would cause situations of total traffic backlog and demonstrate a complete lack of courtesy on the part of cyclists, who would be CHOOSING to make no effort whatsoever to convenience the traffic. Just as the 2-abreast riders do.

[Roscoe]

@mstone 9942 wrote:

I’d much rather have these uncertain and nervous drivers inconvenienced by having to slow down than to have them attempt a pass, chicken out when they see oncoming traffic, and hit the cyclist as they swerve back into their lane. That scenario is extremely common, which is why it is sometimes essential for the cyclist to position himself in the lane in a manner which precludes someone from “squeezing past”. Drivers tend to flatten the cyclist rather than risking a sideswipe by another car. There’s a difference between “courtesy” and self-preservation. If there’s not enough well-maintained shoulder to have an escape route on the right of the white line, the escape route needs to be the right several feet of the lane.

Yeah, sure. SOMETIMES it makes sense. But it sure doesn’t in the majority of cases I see near where I live – where single riders and riders in file are doing just fine……but some feel the need to ride abreast and slow everyone down for no gain whatsoever.

I have NEVER seen a cyclist hit in years of living right next to some of the most heavily cycled roads in Montgomery County. But EVERY weekend I see traffic backed up and travelling at 15 mph (if that) on many roads near here because some cyclists show courtesy, while an astounding number revel in their opportunity to flex their ego and achieve their small victory against motorists by slowing them down unnecessarily.

Which of course doesn’t even factor in the fact that many motorists are not very skilled and most of the “swerving back into their lane” occurs when they have to pass riders abreast by going 100% into the oncoming lane. So not only are these riders being deliberately rude, they’re causing a more dangerous situation for everyone, since most motorists will swerve out to see if they can pass, then often swerve back to not do so.

What’s the problem with the bikers just showing a little courtesy in the first place ?

[creadinger]

@Roscoe 9920 wrote:

So this post just seems to me to be justifying rudeness while cycling. I’ve never seen this problem in any of the other cities I’ve cycled or driven in regularly. And while the traffic around here is also clearly impatient and rude also…at least they are not making a CONSCIOUS DECISION to do something they know will inconvenience other people, as the 2-abreast cyclists appear to be doing. In my area at least, they seem to take it as some opportunity to flex their selfish ability to temporarily seize control of the roads. The repeated rudeness I see from cyclists in this area disgusts me.

Ya know what? You’ve made your point and stated your case…. several times. Sorry that so many people in the DC area disgust you so much, especially compared to all the other idyllic places in the world you keep reminding us about. There have been an abundance of very well stated, thought out responses covering the range of opinions in this forum. And as someone else stated, those “RUDE” cyclists you saw were likely not part of this group. While sometimes people here may take up more of the lane than you think they should, or ride two abreast sometimes it looks like the prevailing opinion is that inconveniencing some drivers for a period of seconds to a minute or two in the name of safety is 100% worthwhile.

If it really bothers you that much, and it appears to do so because you’ve been venting for almost 24 hours now, there are a few things you can do but I don’t think you’ll like those options. So unless you’re prepared to take the non-option of vigilante justice against these “RUDE” people and spend some time in prison, I suggest you let it go and move on with your life.

Much like I am 2 seconds away from doing with this thread.

[Author]

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