Today’s Drivetrains: Who Are The Good Makers

[TwoWheelsDC]

@Jason 150990 wrote:

Sorry to necro post.

Avoid all Shimano 10 speed. This was their first effort with running the cables under the bar tape. Shifting is terrible on these, needing adjustment every 100 miles or less. At least when I had it. This was on all original models of 105, ultegra, dura ace. Shimano fixed this problem with 11 speed by running the cable entry differently into the hoods.

My 10spd 105 (5700) RD shifts slightly better than my 11spd 105 (5800) RD and the only time I’ve ever had to adjust it is when swapping cassettes, and even then it’s like half a turn of the barrel adjuster. Can’t really tell the difference on the FD. ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[AFHokie]

I have just under 4k on the 10 spd tiagra my bike came with and the only time I’ve ever touched the adjustments is when replacing the cassette and it wouldn’t surprise me if I actually de-tuned it by touching the adjusters

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930AZ using Tapatalk

[huskerdont]

9-speed Sora triple rarely needs adjusting. 11-speed Ultegra always defaults to rubbing the cage in the big ring/small cog combo. I’ll adjust it and the next ride it will do it again.

[ian74]

@huskerdont 151007 wrote:

11-speed Ultegra always defaults to rubbing the cage in the big ring/small cog combo. I’ll adjust it and the next ride it will do it again.

You’re doing it wrong!

[huskerdont]

@ian74 151011 wrote:

You’re doing it wrong!

That well may be. I assumed that it was just 11 cogs crammed in less space leaving little room for error and requiring more precise adjustments–minor stretching of the cable that wouldn’t be noticeable on a 9-speed makes more of a difference on an 11-speed. If anyone has any suggestions, I’m all ears. I mean, I haven’t researched it or asked anyone any questions or taken it anywhere. Basically, I’ve tried nuthin’ and I’m all out of ideas.

[TwoWheelsDC]

@ian74 151011 wrote:

You’re doing it wrong!

I think you’re thinking of the big/big combo. Getting all the way to big/small combo is ELITE.

[Jason]

@TwoWheelsDC 150992 wrote:

My 10spd 105 (5700) RD shifts slightly better than my 11spd 105 (5800) RD and the only time I’ve ever had to adjust it is when swapping cassettes, and even then it’s like half a turn of the barrel adjuster. Can’t really tell the difference on the FD. ¯_(ツ)_/¯

That’s wild. My (very good) shop installed 105 101speed was horrible, needing adjustment every other ride (like full rear derailleur adjustment service) and perfectly clean cables (as in new every 1000 miles). My Self-Installed (same bike) and self-sourced (from Merlincycle) 11-speed Ultegra has only needed 2 x quarter turns on the rear barrel adjuster in 3000 miles, no cable changes, and left looking clean-ish but not sparkling clean.

[Harry Meatmotor]

@Jason 151019 wrote:

That’s wild. My (very good) shop installed 105 101speed was horrible, needing adjustment every other ride (like full rear derailleur adjustment service) and perfectly clean cables (as in new every 1000 miles). My Self-Installed (same bike) and self-sourced (from Merlincycle) 11-speed Ultegra has only needed 2 x quarter turns on the rear barrel adjuster in 3000 miles, no cable changes, and left looking clean-ish but not sparkling clean.

So, my humble opinion is that it’s more about the handlebar and where you mount the levers than with the cable ports on the lever. I’ve consistently seen folks with super short and shallow bars (especially women-specific design bars) with the levers mounted high up on the bends into the drops experience crummy shifting, especially into the smaller cogs where increased cable drag is caused by tight bends in the housing. I’ve “fixed” these issues in the past by sticking short sections of bartape under the housing to decrease the radius of any cable housing bends before taping the housing to the bare bar. I’ve had similar issues with SRAM Rival Hydro-R levers on my own CX bike, so it’s not limited to Shimano. Straight out of the box, my brand-spanking new right shifter ate the cable drum because the fixed cable end popped loose from the drum due to tight housing bends/too much friction. Also, not firmly seating the shifter housing in the lever before taping down the housing to the handlebar can cause similar issues.

[ursus]

@Jason 151019 wrote:

That’s wild. My (very good) shop installed 105 101speed was horrible, needing adjustment every other ride (like full rear derailleur adjustment service) and perfectly clean cables (as in new every 1000 miles). My Self-Installed (same bike) and self-sourced (from Merlincycle) 11-speed Ultegra has only needed 2 x quarter turns on the rear barrel adjuster in 3000 miles, no cable changes, and left looking clean-ish but not sparkling clean.

It’s indeed very difficult to keep a 101 speed working properly.

[hozn]

Interesting about Shimano doing a better job with 11sp (than 10sp). I was not impressed with 5700. It just felt so sloppy, requiring frequent adjustment after the first few thousand miles on a drivetrain. I switched to Apex which was so much better. I rode Ultegra-level 11sp (hydro disc) on a European rental for a few days and concluded that Shimano shifting just does have a vague feel about it; this was well adjusted, but I feel spoiled by SRAM’s positive thunk-thunk feedback. I missed it. And Shimano brakes, while they do feel more linearly progressive than my SRAM hydros, did not make up for the shifting. (And the 140 ice tech rotors do *not* stop nearly as well as my 160 Avid rotors, whatever their marketing may claim about 140 being “all you need”.) The Trek Domane disc was a pretty nice bike, though. Certainly was a pleasure to rent it. A 34/50 compact with 11-26 cassette runs out of gears on both ends in the Alps.

Shimano does do front shifting better, but I don’t have front derailleurs anymore, so that isn’t much of a concern.

I suspect I will ride Shimano for a few months this summer, since I will be on travel for a couple months and have mostly resolved to just buy a “cheap” bike to use for that time rather than bring my own.

[Judd]

@hozn 151029 wrote:

The Trek Domane disc was a pretty nice bike, though. Certainly was a pleasure to rent it.

I bought a Domane 5.2 this summer after renting one on a business trip and I love it. Shifting feels great on it. I wish I had disc brakes, though. The 5.2 is a weird gap in the Domane line that doesn’t have a disc brake option. I would have either had to go down a line and downgraded on components or spend $1500 more for similar components, but a higher series carbon. Just looked at the Trek website and it looks like the introduction of the Domane SL models have caused driven the disc brakes into the price range I had at the time. (Also, now I’m longing for an SL model with the sweet front IsoSpeed Decoupler)

[peterw_diy]

For touring (which I’ve done) or rando (which I haven’t) I think the most important thing is you need to gain skills to make basic adjustments – at least gears & brakes – yourself. Don’t go for maximum reliability hoping you will never need to wrench.

Adjustable housing stops that allow you to tweak gear cable tension mid ride are great for letting you address minor shifting trouble without stopping. Downtube mounted ones (that go on shifter bosses) are far easier to use than ones that are not fixed to the frame but go inline with the gear housing.

IMO the current generation Campy Ergopower levers are the most comfortable brake levers around, much nicer in the hand than Shimano brifters or most dedicated brake-only levers. I can’t speak to how well full Campy drivetrains work though as brifters are my only Campy parts.

I do like the idea of the better cable pull ratios for SRAM and Campy, and find that my SRAM equipped cargo bike has less trouble – even with much longer cables and lower end components – than my Shimano bikes.

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