Time to go carbon, thoughts on frames

[SteveTheTech]

Greetings all,

You guys are always such a good wealth of knowledge and I was hoping you could offer your collective two cents on something for me.

I’m looking at replacing the frame that is a little too large for me. I like the performance of the low end aluminum frame (Dawes), my biggest issue is its size. I’ve begun the process of shopping for a new frame and have it narrowed down to a few fairly highly rated ones within a budget, I’m still on the fence whether to build one from scratch or buy a whole bike. At this point I am partial to entire unit replacement that way I can start collecting parts in the mid range instead of collecting entry level items I have in triplicate. When I bought my first bike I was looking for components over frame weight and geometry…this time I am going the opposite way. I would rather have a lighter frame with a Rival or 105 groupset than compromise on the frame. Since the majority of the difference above those levels is primarily weight saving, and are easily upgradable.

At the top of my list sits the Specialized Tarmac.
My wife has a Ruby and loves it, I’ve riden hers and it’s just a beast, compared to what I’ve got now. This is also the only one in the group with a standard crank.

[img]http://s7d5.scene7.com/is/image/Specialized/9927?$Hero$[/img]

Next up we have the Litespeed C1R- I love aero frames….This one on is one of the aeroest of the aero. They are fairly well reviewed and seem to hold up well.

From Competitive Cyclist this one comes in perfectly within my budget and has a Rival setup.

Rounding out my top three is Canondale, not just one…several. I really like the CAAD10-3 I can bump up one component set if I go with super lightweight aluminum and save several hundred bucks. I also like the carbon lineup. I think that may be something I have to go try out. I’ll need to find some hills near TSFKAFB

At dream level…if I could would be this beauty, with an Ultegra groupset.

As a backup I am thinking the Specialized Roubaix- It is a little softer riding than the Tarmac and just about the same with the exception of the Zert inserts….not convinced that is worth it though. But this one is supposed to be more comfortable on longer rides, again I am not convinced being so similar that any real differences will ever be noted.
—Too many photos, it looks like a red Tarmac basically—-

Any thoughts, comments, or additions would be greatly appreciated…thanks

Topic

[off2ride]

I’d go for the Cannondale Super Six or EVO for everyday riding. Shimano Dura Ace groupset would be my first choice, (wait for the 11 speed DA version) Campy 11 Record 2nd then Sram 4th.

[bluerider]

As always it depends on how you are going to use it. I made the switch to carbon over the winter (a Blue Norcross EX). If you are planning to run errands and lock it up at bike racks and public place I don’t recommend it. Carbon is just to fragile and impact sensitive to take all the hits and bangs at bike racks. But if you are going to use for recreational riding, Centuries, racing, etc they are nice. The ride is very nice compared to Al frames. If you get a carbon frame, you really need to own a torque wrench. The torque specs on carbon frames are very important to avoid overtightening and causing stress cracks. I am thinking about building a steel single speed commuter to use on day to day riding just because my carbon bike is not “public” friendly. Any of those bikes are going to be nice. Ride them all and pick the one you like best.

[DaveK]

Although the Litespeed looks aero, testing showed it to be less so than most other “aero bikes” when it comes to drag. Does that matter? Not a single bit. No one outside of a pro will ever notice.

I really like the Tarmac personally, the geometry is spot-on (for me, anyway) and it’s a proven frame. You really can’t go wrong with any of those frames. The recent Tarmac frames have a little higher head tube than the older ones so the difference to the Roubaix, especially in smaller frame sizes, isn’t as noticeable.

Bottom like though, those are all great and you should ride them all and pick the one that speaks to you.

If you’re on a budget, I promise you the bike manufacturers can buy components cheaper than you can. Just buy a complete bike.

[Mark Blacknell]

Go local?

[Greenbelt]

I’ll throw in my two cents, which is just that — not worth much! I like my aluminum frame with carbon fork and seat stays. Seems to have the combination of durability, power, and vibration/shock reduction without the price tag. Likewise some of the lightweight steel bikes have a very good ride and still pretty dang light without the carbon price. And as rough as I am on my bikes too….. anyways, something to consider.

[Dirt]

You’ve mentioned a bunch of bikes that are completely different, have completely different uses, purposes and fit.

Start at the beginning…. before you ever look at different bikes.

1) What kind of riding do you do? Do you race? You doing centuries? Is climbing your thing? You prefer long, rolling centuries?

2) Geometry: How flexible are you? Take an HONEST look at your basic bike configuration right now. Where are the tops of the bars in relation to the saddle? Are they equal height? Are your bars lower than your saddle? 1″ lower? 4″? 6″? In your current configuration, how often do you use the drops? Can you ride for 30 minutes in the drops comfortably? When you’re in the drops, are your arms completely straight?

3) Fit: Get a professional fit, if you haven’t already. It helps.

4) THEN start to pick a frame style. Lots of manufacturers have frames that have a hair more mellow config than their race bikes. The Geometry is roughly the same, but the head tube is a hair taller, making it easier to have the bars a little higher. Sometimes the chain stays are a hair longer to make the handling a tiny bit more mellow. They’re similar in weight and have lots of the same characteristics and feel, but will fit you a little different. Specialized’s race bike is the Tarmac series. Their slightly more relaxed is the Roubaix. (yes, there are other differences). Cervelo has the R3 and RS. Trek has the Madone and a slightly higher head-tube version of the Madone.

Okay… so you have the size and the general style of the frame. Do you want a bike that excels in climbing? Aerodynamics? There are compromises that give you some aero while maintaining low weight. Will you give up a bit of stiffness for comfort and shock absorption?

Do you plan to travel with the bike (Bikes with an integrated seat mast do not travel as well.)

5) TEST RIDE! Try a bunch of stuff. That will tell you amazing things. I strongly suggest working with a local shop that can help you with your choice.

My personal favorites for ride quality: Cervelo R3 — Probably the most comfortable bike I’ve ever ridden. Moots Vamoots…. I’d really like an RSL. I haven’t ridden an aero road bike that I really love.

Hope that helps.

Pete

[Tim Kelley]

Your other option is to just buy the prettiest one.

[Dirt]

@Tim Kelley 24939 wrote:

Your other option is to just buy the prettiest one.

I already own it and it isn’t for sale. Sorry.

[americancyclo]

I’ve been riding a Specialized Roubaix for the past two years and have been quite happy with it. It’s served me well on my commute (although I think it’s a bit overkill, I don’t often stop or lock it anywhere, and I have guarded underground parking. It’s done well on a few centuries, and my only complaint would be that the ultegra wheels that came on it are more race-friendly than custis trail bumpy root section-friendly. I like that it’s not as aggressive as a tarmac because I have really poor hamstring flexibility, and that affects my back flexibility. It doesn’t have as much cache as a smaller company, but it makes me happy!

[rcannon100]

There is a third way that is subscribed to by many of the participants here that they are not fessing up to…. just buy them ALL!

[GuyContinental]

I’m with Dirt- we don’t know enough about your planned use or style or riding to make a great recommendation. Still, you have several great bikes picked out-
I like both of the Specialized but would go for the Roubaix hands-down for everyday everything riding. If you need a race-day beast then the Tarmac. If you want a Specialized and want to race, NCVC has some sort of reasonable Specialized pro-deal for members. Lot’s of Tarmacs on that team.

Also, you seem to be vacillating between SRAM and Shimano on your groupo- IMO Rival doubletap wins if you live in your drops because of the floating shifter but I don’t really like the way it downshifts- Shimano always feels crisper down to me. (I have Force/Rival on my CX and Ultegra on my roadie- switching between the two can be confusing).

[Dirt]

Good points, Guy. It comes down to personal preference. I haven’t raced in decades and I still prefer the ride and feel of a race bike. When shopping for my Cervelo, I rode the RS (taller head tube and a little longer chain stays) and hated it. I got on the R3 (full race geometry) and felt right at home. We’re all different… It comes down to experience and flexibility and what we like.

[elcee]

The more bike reviews I read, the less I trust them. Not because the reviewers are incompetent, but I’ve realized that the “feel” of a bike is so personal. Two people, riding the same frame in identical sizes, will perceive different stiffness and comfort if there’s a 30 lb difference in body weights.

When I looked for my latest bike, aero just wasn’t a factor – my rides aren’t long or fast enough to make a difference.

I tried a Cannondale CAAD8: it’s sportscar fast and very exciting, but ultimately I found it too bumpy on our typical roads.

Specialized Allez: comfortable, but there was something about upright position that I didn’t like. Granted, the test bike had a lot of spacers, but its ride wasn’t magical enough for me to invest more time in it.

I finally bought a used LeMond Victoire, as it felt good right away … and more importantly, it brought a smile to my face.

Bottom line: try a lot of bikes, then work with the shop to make sure it fits.

P.S. I know none of these are carbon (!), but there here to illustrate my point.

I also forgot that I was intrigued by the Gunnar Roadie. It had all the specs, plus optional custom paint. Unfortunately, no one had a full bike to try, and I just didn’t want to leave a $1000 purchase to chance.

[Tim Kelley]

@GuyContinental 25001 wrote:

Also, you seem to be vacillating between SRAM and Shimano on your groupo- IMO Rival doubletap wins if you live in your drops because of the floating shifter but I don’t really like the way it downshifts- Shimano always feels crisper down to me. (I have Force/Rival on my CX and Ultegra on my roadie- switching between the two can be confusing).

I personally prefer Shimano over SRAM, because they have larger hoods. The SRAM just feels small in my hands. Your results may vary–that’s why it’s so important to do test rides!

[jabberwocky]

I built up an Ibis Silk SL last autumn as my first carbon road bike and couldn’t be happier. I had a very good idea what geometry I wanted, but had no idea what the ride would be like. I got lucky, I suppose. Test riding is a good thing if you can manage it.

@Tim Kelley 25015 wrote:

I personally prefer Shimano over SRAM, because they have larger hoods. The SRAM just feels small in my hands. Your results may vary–that’s why it’s so important to do test rides!

And I’m the exact opposite, for the same reason. I have smaller hands, and the SRAM hoods work much better for me.

[Author]

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