Serial Broken Spokes

[Terpfan]

Performance to their credit gave me another wheel (cyclocross that fits). Ridley’s just too cheap to stand behind their product. Lesson learned. Funny you mentioned getting off factory wheels, as my hybrid’s second wheel has been an absolutely awesome and tough.

[peterw_diy]

@Terpfan 112749 wrote:

Not yet. I’m thinking social media is my next outlet if Performance doesn’t succeed, but I figured best to let them try first.

IMO you should write this up on bikeforums.net where it will get more visibility, and reduce Ridley’s ability to make that absurd Historical Infalibilty claim in the future.

[Terpfan]

Damnit, I had a rear non-drivetrain side spoke snap on me at the hub. I think something got into my wheel on the MVT by where the NPS guys were mowing the grass. Twig, rock, or something, because i heard the pang as if something got in there and hit the back of my heel. I suppose it could have been the spoke itself, but I don’t think it would have flown out that way so easily. Needless to say, bah, I’ve had the worst luck with spokes on this bike. I literally think I replaced one spoke ever or maybe two on my hybrid in 3 years of owning it.

[Terpfan]

And, I’ll tag on, the guys at Bicycle Pro Shop on M St (right at Key Bridge) were awesome. I explained the issue and that I needed it to ride home. They fixed it for me while I waited. I know the LBS’ are all back-logged with stuff so as a commuter, I especially appreciate them doing that for me.

[Lt. Dan]

When I first bought my Fuji, I broke a spoke on my first three rides!!!! after the third time, I loosened all of them, re-tensioned both wheels, and used loc-tite on the nipples. Over a thousand miles later, and no issues with breaking or loosening spokes

[hozn]

With sufficient tension, you don’t need loctite; I suspect the real fix was that you retensioned it.

@Terpfan, at minimum you need those wheels completely rebuilt. Worst-case (if the rims are too out of true to build with even spoke tensions), you need new wheels. Get hand-built wheels or factory wheels that are known to be high-quality. With factory wheels, have someone check the tensions after a couple hundred miles in case the spokes unwind. With hand built wheels, no spokes should be unwinding (if you hear pinging sounds when you start riding them take them back to have tensions checked).

[Terpfan]

@hozn 116385 wrote:

With sufficient tension, you don’t need loctite; I suspect the real fix was that you retensioned it.

@Terpfan, at minimum you need those wheels completely rebuilt. Worst-case (if the rims are too out of true to build with even spoke tensions), you need new wheels. Get hand-built wheels or factory wheels that are known to be high-quality. With factory wheels, have someone check the tensions after a couple hundred miles in case the spokes unwind. With hand built wheels, no spokes should be unwinding (if you hear pinging sounds when you start riding them take them back to have tensions checked).

That’s the weird thing. The rear wheel is relatively new. They took back that crappy factory one for me and gave me a new (slightly nicer) cross wheel as a replacement. I noticed the spokes out of tension once on the new wheel and had them tightened, but no real problems until today when the spoke break. So this would be the first spoke on this new rear wheel.

So do you think it may be something else causing it like the hub? I’m trying to think of what else could cause it. I’m not a small guy (6’3 255 or so), but no one at LBSes seem to think that was the issue given the bike frames size. Leaving me kind of at a loss for what’s causing it.

The actual ride itself is all roads and trails–little bit of Wisconsin Ave, 33rd/34th/35th in Georgetown, MVT, Beacon Hill Rd, etc–so nothing that’s off-road or even all that too bumpy, imo.

[Steve O]

@Terpfan 116386 wrote:

That’s the weird thing. The rear wheel is relatively new. They took back that crappy factory one for me and gave me a new (slightly nicer) cross wheel as a replacement. I noticed the spokes out of tension once on the new wheel and had them tightened, but no real problems until today when the spoke break. So this would be the first spoke on this new rear wheel.

If I understand you, this is the first spoke on the new wheel. I would hang tight until you break another. If that doesn’t happen, then you are good, and it was an anomaly or it was caused by being struck or something. If another one goes in the next couple of months, then it’s a bigger problem.

[hozn]

Hmmm, so the tensions of (all) the spokes on the new wheel were the same (at least within 5-10%) and were all high enough? (Do you know what the tension was / should have been?) I have definitely seen (gotten) wheels that were simply under-tensioned. That is a sure recipe for spokes breaking, especially with larger riders. Double-buttes spokes, I presume? (You may not know whether they are, but probably safe assumption on a decent wheel.)

[hozn]

Maybe time for 36h? Assuming these were 32h.

[Terpfan]

@Steve O 116388 wrote:

If I understand you, this is the first spoke on the new wheel. I would hang tight until you break another. If that doesn’t happen, then you are good, and it was an anomaly or it was caused by being struck or something. If another one goes in the next couple of months, then it’s a bigger problem.

Correct, it’s the first broken spoke on the replacement wheel. I had previously noticed one of the spokes had become looser and taken it by Spokes on the way home one day to adjust. They tightened them all and I didn’t notice anything for the next probably 15 or 20 rides or so until today when it broke.

@hozn 116389 wrote:

Hmmm, so the tensions of (all) the spokes on the new wheel were the same (at least within 5-10%) and were all high enough? (Do you know what the tension was / should have been?) I have definitely seen (gotten) wheels that were simply under-tensioned. That is a sure recipe for spokes breaking, especially with larger riders. Double-buttes spokes, I presume? (You may not know whether they are, but probably safe assumption on a decent wheel.)

Yes, I would suspect the tensions were the same as the mechanic at Spokes tightened them to bring it true for me when the one was loose the other week. I suspect the wheel started way under-tensioned from where it should have been. I’m pretty sure the answer on double-buttes is yes, although I admit to being not knowledgable to know the difference one way or the other.

[hozn]

If you already had a spoke get loose (and corrected it), i feel very confident that the problem is systemic (that loose spoke would have broken shortly thereafter): you need to have the wheel rebuilt or they will just keep breaking. I suspect the mechanic did not completely retension wheel? (I have had spokes replaced and wheels trued by mechanics and then spokes kept breaking until wheels were completely detensioned and rebuilt.)

Of course, I hope I am wrong. I have been down this road a few times, though, and eventually decided I would build all my own wheels. That ended the epidemic, though I won’t pretend there wasn’t some learning with my early commuter disc-brake wheels.

[Terpfan]

@hozn 116392 wrote:

If you already had a spoke get loose (and corrected it), i feel very confident that the problem is systemic (that loose spoke would have broken shortly thereafter): you need to have the wheel rebuilt or they will just keep breaking. I suspect the mechanic did not completely retension wheel? (I have had spokes replaced and wheels trued by mechanics and then spokes kept breaking until wheels were completely detensioned and rebuilt.)

Of course, I hope I am wrong. I have been down this road a few times, though, and eventually decided I would build all my own wheels. That ended the epidemic, though I won’t pretend there wasn’t some learning with my early commuter disc-brake wheels.

And, boom, there it goes again. Second broken spoke (had to have it re-tensioned twice prior to both brakes). The thing is that since this is the second wheel on the same bike (they replaced the first one with a new cyclocross wheel), I’m left with the impression that maybe there is something to the frame design that’s putting untoward pressure on the rear wheel?

The reason I say that is because on hybrid, I literally had one broken spoke the entire time I owned it. I even replaced wheels prior to actual broken spokes because it just wasn’t an issue. This bike is now 10 months old and between two entirely different wheels, I’ve had 5 or maybe 6 spokes break now. I’m trying a different Performance Bike at lunch time in Rockville.

If all else fails, I’ll see if they actually honor their return system and then I’m going to just go elsewhere and pick something that everyone rides with less mechanical difficulties.

*Fingers crossed* (again).

[hozn]

@Terpfan 118755 wrote:

And, boom, there it goes again. Second broken spoke (had to have it re-tensioned twice prior to both brakes). The thing is that since this is the second wheel on the same bike (they replaced the first one with a new cyclocross wheel), I’m left with the impression that maybe there is something to the frame design that’s putting untoward pressure on the rear wheel?

I’m pretty confident they’re just badly built wheels; I haven’t ever heard of a bike frame being the culprit for broken spokes (although, sure, if you’re loading up the bike that is a factor). It’s primarily about weight (you+bike) on the wheels (and impacts, etc.). Both wheelsets sound like they have been junk. There is no shortage of garbage wheels out there that will work fine for the person that rides their bike 5 miles a few times times a year, but they won’t hold up to daily use/abuse. If you don’t want to pay for better wheels (best to get hand-built, but some of the better brands like Easton also build their off-the-shelf wheels by hand) then I’d say go for more spokes. Not sure what you have now but maybe go with a 32-spoke wheelset.

@Terpfan 118755 wrote:

The reason I say that is because on hybrid, I literally had one broken spoke the entire time I owned it. I even replaced wheels prior to actual broken spokes because it just wasn’t an issue. This bike is now 10 months old and between two entirely different wheels, I’ve had 5 or maybe 6 spokes break now. I’m trying a different Performance Bike at lunch time in Rockville.

It sounds like you just got “lucky” with the Hybrid and it came with a decent set of wheels. They probably also had more spokes, so that can mitigate an otherwise poor build.

@Terpfan 118755 wrote:

If all else fails, I’ll see if they actually honor their return system and then I’m going to just go elsewhere and pick something that everyone rides with less mechanical difficulties.

Well, I wouldn’t return bike because of the wheelset, but I suppose you could choose another bike with different wheels and get lucky. Performance (and Nashbar? Others?) carry a Mavic Open Pro / Ultegra wheelset, 32h — seems like that would be a pretty good choice. http://www.performancebike.com/bikes/Product_10052_10551_1158367_-1_400934__400934

There is also an Open Pro 105 wheelset that is cheaper (and heavier). Neither of those will be light, but it might fix the problem.

[Lt. Dan]

@hozn 116385 wrote:

With sufficient tension, you don’t need loctite; I suspect the real fix was that you retensioned it.

You’re probably right, but as an old Jarhead I’m a fan of “overkill”- If I see a spider on my desk, I’m inclined to burn my entire office down… just to make sure it’s dead….

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