Rain gear expectations too high?

[AFHokie]

I have a lot of gear from years of camping and from years in the field while in the military, but I’ve been looking at wet weather/winter clothing and trying to figure out what will work for cycling. The cycling specific jackets I’ve looked at have not impressed me.

Even in cold weather it’s a given I’ll sweat, so any jacket I’d want must have pit zips for ventilation. Any true waterproof jacket will cause you to sweat with any amount of physical activity. If saturated Gore-Tex will loose the ability to repel water, but based on my experiences I think Gore-Tex is the best option.

I currently have a Gore-Tex North Face rain jacket that’s worked well while hiking/walking, but it is not long enough to completely cover my back while riding. Additionally, the hood blocks my vision too much and doesn’t fit very well over a bike helmet. I already ordered a Gore helmet cover…curious as to how well that’ll block the rain from running down my head through the vents.

Let’s also not forget preferably a jacket that’s hi-viz.

I don’t have much faith in any rain pants. The only truly waterproof pants I’ve ever owned were my ski pants and those are entirely too bulky (and too hot) to wear on a bike. Right now my assumption is to wear thermal tights that will block the wind and hopefully, they’ll have some similarity to wool or neoprene and still keep me warm even when wet. So far what I’ve found online doesn’t leave me hopeful unless I’m willing to spend.

Based on previous outdoor experiences I want a dedicated winter shoe. I’m looking at Lake Cycling or 45NRTH Wölvhammer but they’re pricey.

[Dickie]

Thanks everyone for the great information. I agree with most everything stated below. When I was commuting only 12 miles each way I was less concerned… a few well placed merino wool garments and I was fine. If the temp dropped below 45º then my winter gear was enough. Now that I’m riding 30-40 miles each day getting really wet is more of a problem. Yesterday I left the house early enough that the wind, rain, and temp was just too much for a 20 mile ride without proper protection. I have given up on my feet and only expect better protection if I buy dedicated shoes for the task. The covers as many have stated work for a short time but eventually leak in all the obvious places…I wear merino wool socks in the rain so at least I am warm when wet.

The Flyte jacket is wonderful in almost all it’s details (high-vis, great cut, pit zips, protected pockets, etc), I was just surprised how quickly the waterproofing failed. I will take Dirt’s advice and try re-applying Nikwax. As SteveO mentioned, some garments suggest the dryer treatment to re-activate the DWR, however with Endura they suggest against this as the heat could damage the sealed/taped seams. Endura requires that you use a “cool” iron to re-activate the DWR. Shower Pass doesn’t provide much use care. One thing all these water proof garments have in common is the recommended type of detergent you must use, but this also gets confusing. Basically you do not want a detergent that has any softeners, perfumes, or dyes in them as these will clog and damage the breathability and also the repellency of the garment. However, British companies like Endura require you use a non-biological powder for cleaning purposes, but finding an equivalent here in the US is not easy. Basically soap flakes is what they require. Apparently biological detergents (what we use everyday;Tide, etc) have enzymes in them that clean deeply in cooler temps, but these enzymes damage the DWR properties. Non-Biological detergents use no enzymes but require harsher chemicals to clean well at cool temps… so confusing. If you google this stuff prepare to be overwhelmed… and then when you add in cleaning merino… UGHH!

All in all, perhaps I am expecting too much, and even though I was tootling along I am sure my core heated up over the 20 miles to make me sweat just as much as normal, and thus trapping me in a sauna.

Cheers

[Rockford10]

@dkel 95420 wrote:

I just had a surprisingly long talk with Rockford10 about rain gear, and she and I don’t have the same feelings on the topic. It’s apparent to me that everyone’s comfort level and needs are different, so there’s no right or wrong answer, aside from what works or doesn’t work for you. Unfortunately, spending money is usually required before you can figure that out.

I just don’t melt in the rain and it’s never bothered me that much. I do have some “rain resistant” pieces, but with the length of my commute and the fact that there is a warm shower and dry clothes at the end of the ride, I have no interest in spending real cash on rain gear. I can see myself making one of the Ikea hack ponchos, but would rather buy another wool icebreaker top.

I note that DKel’s on his second set of rain gear in the past 12 months. REI’s return policy rocks when the pants no longer repel rain.

[Crickey7]

Courtesy of bikesnobnyc: “bicycling in a cleanroom coverall is possible.”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMQTY_UwrVg

[dkel]

@Rockford10 95452 wrote:

I note that DKel’s on his second set of rain gear in the past 12 months. REI’s return policy rocks when the pants no longer repel rain.

True, but they also explain to you that you can’t wash their rain gear in regular detergent, but rather in tech wash of some sort, to which I reply that that information should be on the care label instead of “machine wash, drip dry.” I don’t like taking advantage of the return policy there, either, or they won’t have it anymore, so I’m determined to keep the current rain duds up to spec (somehow).

[Dickie]

@dkel 95477 wrote:

True, but they also explain to you that you can’t wash their rain gear in regular detergent, but rather in tech wash of some sort, to which I reply that that information should be on the care label instead of “machine wash, drip dry.” I don’t like taking advantage of the return policy there, either, or they won’t have it anymore, so I’m determined to keep the current rain duds up to spec (somehow).

Read my convoluted description of cleaning instructions below… you’ll never wash your rain gear again!

[FFX_Hinterlands]

@mstone 95359 wrote:

For the rain cape advocates, how fast do you go in those? I’d kinda assumed that if you were moving fast they wouldn’t do much (rain would be going in horizontally) so I haven’t tried one.

The cape is out over your hands and handlebars, so it blocks rain coming from the front and keeps it off of your thighs. So it’s long in the front. I have the Rivendell one and I wear it with an old pair of hiking gaitors or high boots. Works in even the heaviest downpours. A bonus is that it keeps your hands and handlebars dry. The downside is that you need a light that is not mounted on your handlebars (I have one mounted lower on a rando rack).

[Raymo853]

@mstone 95359 wrote:

In my experience you can either get wet from the outside or wet from the inside, but you can never stay dry. I’ll wear rain gear when it’s cold enough that the rain is going to pose a health risk, but I still expect to need to change at the end of the trip.

100% agree. I never expect my skin to be totally dry, even with my super fancy and expensive jacket, full fenders, rain-resistant tights and pants over them, and winter shoes. I always end up damp and needing a shower.

Your skin is waterproof keeping the rain out of your organs. The main goal of rain/winter clothing, keep you skin healthy and able to keep the rain out.

[ctankcycles]

It’s not cheap, but rain apparel that uses Schoeller fabric is, in my experience, even better than Gore-Tex. I’ve had the Search and State S1-J jacket that uses Schoeller fabric for about a year and it keeps me dry for long periods of time, including a torrential downpour out in Colorado in August. I was hesitant at first since it doesn’t have pit zips but I had heard the breathe-ability is so good that they’re not necessary and I’ve found that to be true. Like I said, it’s not cheap, but it’s very high quality fabric and construction, and made in the NYC garment district so if supporting made in the USA cycling companies is important to you, it’s worth considering. Also, for what it’s worth, the S1-A is a beautiful jersey.

[Dickie]

*Update: Cleaning my rain gear (Endura Flight rain jacket, ShowerPass Convertible pants, P.I. booties) in NikWax tech wash and then using the wash-in to reactivate the DWR has made my gear work amazingly well (thanks Dirt for the tip), in fact I think it actually breathes better as well. Add to that the acquisition of some Sealskinz waterproof gloves and a gifted gore waterproof hat from consularrider and I have never been happier in the rain. Riding 40+ miles in constant rain was actually pleasant. I arrived home completely dry from hands to feet… amazballs!

[Orestes Munn]

@Dickie 101248 wrote:

*Update: Cleaning my rain gear (Endura Flight rain jacket, ShowerPass Convertible pants, P.I. booties) in NikWax tech wash and then using the wash-in to reactivate the DWR has made my gear work amazingly well (thanks Dirt for the tip), in fact I think it actually breathes better as well. Add to that the acquisition of some Sealskinz waterproof gloves and a gifted gore waterproof hat from consularrider and I have never been happier in the rain. Riding 40+ miles in constant rain was actually pleasant. I arrived home completely dry from hands to feet… amazballs!

I have had good luck with the NikWax 2-stage treatment on sailing foulies, too, even the bottoms of the bottoms, which live for hours between wet decks and cold asses and fail rapidly. However, I couldn’t ride 40 mi in February, wearing a Goretex tutu and a loose Livestrong band, without working up a good shvitz.

[creadinger]

I focus on staying warm, rather than staying dry. Because I know I’ll get wet, whether it’s from rain or sweat.

Rain repellency is never a bad thing, but waterproof just doesn’t seem to exist in my world.

[Crickey7]

I don’t get how to keep water from getting into footwear from the top down or the bottom up, even if the footwear itself is waterproof? That’s what keeps me from riding when it’s raining and in the 30’s or below. I’ve had some extremely uncomfortable experiences.

[hozn]

@Crickey7 101507 wrote:

I don’t get how to keep water from getting into footwear from the top down or the bottom up, even if the footwear itself is waterproof? That’s what keeps me from riding when it’s raining and in the 30’s or below. I’ve had some extremely uncomfortable experiences.

These seem to work very well: http://www.amazon.com/Outdoor-Research-Mens-Verglas-Gaiters/dp/B009Q1BGDE

I think I bought them because I saw a picture of Dirt using them. I tend to automatically buy anything [that I can afford] that Dirt uses or vouches for

Anyway, they work well, but they do make your lower leg warmer — so sweat may be more of a concern if you’re wearing them over rain paints (presumably you are). And depending on the shoe/boot, water may be coming in from the bottom (cleat) (as you obviously are aware). When I went for a ride on Saturday afternoon in the rain, these gaiters kept water from entering my boots from the top, but after about 45 minutes the front of my socks were still wet from water coming up into the shoes. (I have warmer boots that are fully sealed, but it’s not cold enough for those yet.)

Anyway, my $0.02. One thing I will say is that I’m unsure how to do the sizing for those gaiters. I just went by pant sizes and got a Large, but I’m at the very limit of having them be tight enough to keep from slipping down above the calf. Perhaps this just means I need bigger calf muscles. If I went by their sizing (based on shoe size) I’d have an XXL which would be way too huge.

Edit: Also, I agree that the must important thing is just staying warm, not dry.

[Orestes Munn]

@Crickey7 101507 wrote:

I don’t get how to keep water from getting into footwear from the top down or the bottom up, even if the footwear itself is waterproof? That’s what keeps me from riding when it’s raining and in the 30’s or below. I’ve had some extremely uncomfortable experiences.

I have had fairly good luck with the (nominally) breathable waterproof socks, for keeping my feet dryish while wearing Keens, sailing in cool (not cold!) weather. I have tried the Seal brand and another (forget the name), which has real Gortex and a nice cuff, but no stretch. However, at those temps you really need some insulation and there is even a risk of non-freezing cold injury on long rides, particularly when the feet are wet.

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