Prius Haters Abound

[jabberwocky]

@Subby 58940 wrote:

Smug and wealthy? Not exactly how I would characterize most drivers of alternative fuel cars. Sure, maybe some are one or the other, but my guess is that most folks just want to save a few bucks on gas every month. Wealthy folks are driving Audis and BMWs and Range Rovers and MBs. NOT Prii.

Priuses are incredibly trendy among the wealthy of this area. You see a ton of them in the more expensive parts of the region (Great Falls/McLean, Loudoun horse country, etc) where your average motorist could certainly afford something more expensive if they want. Eco-fashion is alive and well.

[Subby]

@jrenaut 58944 wrote:

It depends on where you draw your “wealthy” line. The point JeffC is making (I think) is that it’s better for the environment to carpool in a 7 year old Honda Accord than it is to drive by yourself in a brand new Prius.

Sure, and I agree. I think living in McLean has warped my expectations of what is normal.

[JeffC]

@DaveK 58938 wrote:

This isn’t strictly true anymore – hybrids with a “clean fuel” tag issued after 2011 (don’t recall exact month/date) aren’t exempt from the HOV restrictions on 395 or 66. Those from earlier years are grandfathered in.

Ok, did not realize that, still a nice benefit to be grandfathered in. Yes I do think it is more benefical to carpool in a 7 year old Accord than alone in a Prius, emissions burnt are probably the same and all other things being equal, carpooling would take another car off the road but somehow Prius = Pious while carpooling = low class.

How many of the wealthiest 10 counties in the US are in the DC area? This area is incredibly wealthy compared to just about any other in the country.

[KLizotte]

True, carpooling in a prius would be preferred but just remember they aren’t emitting awful toxins into the air in urban cores where we all ride bikes and breathe in the nasty stuff. I’d rather have all of downtown DC be filled with natural gas vehicles and priuses so I don’t have to breathe in particulate matter from gas/diesel engines.

[NicDiesel]

@JeffC 58976 wrote:

How many of the wealthiest 10 counties in the US are in the DC area? This area is incredibly wealthy compared to just about any other in the country.

I was explaining this to a friend of mine in the lower part of this state and he just couldn’t understand that a family making $125K is at the lower end of “middle class” here. I think living here for any appreciable amount of time really warps your view on things, at least from a financial and employment standpoint.

[lordofthemark]

@ShawnoftheDread 58951 wrote:

Perhaps not wealthy, but able to afford a premium of $10K or so to get a hybrid over a non-hybrid of similar size. And they may think they’re saving a few bucks on gas, but they won’t actually see that savings for several years because of the initial price increase.

but the car price can be financed, so thats also spread over several years. When we got our Civic, we also test drove a Prius. I did the calculations and it didn’t make sense for us (even given a reasonable value for wanting to be more ecofriendly) but for someone who drove more, and most of that in congestion (we do a lot of trips back and forth to family in NYC, which adds miles but most of that we can get could mileage inth Civic despite the occasional back up in the Turnpike) I think it could. So I don’t think its only for wealthy folks, unless you think any new compact sedan is.

[jabberwocky]

Yeah, I don’t think Priuses are really a rich persons car based on price; they are, what, low-mid 20k? Thats more than most econo-boxes, but much cheaper than pretty much any SUV, cheaper than anything from the luxury brands and less than anything from Germany aside from a few entry level VWs.

The Prius just has a certain prestige as an eco-fashion-mobile. And I think owning one makes people feel better about tremendously long commutes, which are common in this area.

[ShawnoftheDread]

@lordofthemark 58996 wrote:

but the car price can be financed, so thats also spread over several years. When we got our Civic, we also test drove a Prius. I did the calculations and it didn’t make sense for us (even given a reasonable value for wanting to be more ecofriendly) but for someone who drove more, and most of that in congestion (we do a lot of trips back and forth to family in NYC, which adds miles but most of that we can get could mileage inth Civic despite the occasional back up in the Turnpike) I think it could. So I don’t think its only for wealthy folks, unless you think any new compact sedan is.

Financing increases the cost, so you save even less. And financing $10K more means a bigger payment, immediately offsetting any monthly gas savings.

[mello yello]

There’s plenty of high mileage 2004-2009 (“gen 2”) priuses (ahem, sorry prii) out there. High mileage = lots of highway miles in the HOV lanes of 66 and 95… which are pretty easy miles, all things considered. No financing needed, they’re about the same as a standard car 2 years newer. The battery costs are coming down, but really look at how many prius taxis there are and those things are the ultimate torture test for batteries.

Also, a lot of the hybrids try to be upscale. Now you have Lincoln selling hybrid and standard at the exact same price, so some of the cost premium may have just been for features. Prius is a little hard to compare, since the closest you could come was maybe the Matrix.

personal anecdote:

Insurance pays x,xxx dollars for the ’01 Camry that was totalled while parked in front of our house (drunk driver, 4am Sunday morning, hit & run)
My wife drives a lot for work. As in commutes to Catonsville, with at least quarterly trips to Annapolis and Easton.
So, we look at hybrids. for an additional 2k we can buy a 2005 Prius with 100k miles on it. The missing wheel covers, a couple cigarette burns on the interior, and dent in the door keep the purchase price well under $10,000. We pay cash, discover that DC charges exactly $0 tax on “advanced vehicles”. Insurance is cheap, our dogs fit in the hatchback w/ the seats down, and it becomes our trip car. Gas savings ensue. 50k in two years, we’ve been averaging 48-50 mpg.

Also, it fits a bike in the back without removing wheels.

[mstone]

@jabberwocky 58999 wrote:

Yeah, I don’t think Priuses are really a rich persons car based on price; they are, what, low-mid 20k? Thats more than most econo-boxes, but much cheaper than pretty much any SUV, cheaper than anything from the luxury brands and less than anything from Germany aside from a few entry level VWs.

24k up to around 40k with options. Welcome to the DC alternate reality zone.

[jabberwocky]

@mstone 59018 wrote:

24k up to around 40k with options. Welcome to the DC alternate reality zone.

I tried Toyotas website, but even adding all the crazy options (seriously, theres a “performance package” for the Prius?!) I couldn’t get the MSRP that high. Even at 30k though, the Prius is far from a crazy expensive car. I mean, I don’t see a Ford Explorer or a BMW 3 series (similarly priced cars) and think “that person must be rich”.

[lordofthemark]

@ShawnoftheDread 59004 wrote:

Financing increases the cost, so you save even less. And financing $10K more means a bigger payment, immediately offsetting any monthly gas savings.

look, you either can buy for cash or you can’t. If can you can do the ROI on the cash, and if you can’t you compare the payment including interest (which is low these last few years) to the gas savings. Even for us who dont drive that much and some of it is highway in free flow, it was close enough to want to think about. Its really not as impractical for everyone as folks here are making out.

[lordofthemark]

http://automobiles.honda.com/shop/civics.aspx?kwid=15043480&adgrpid=375486540&ef_id=HeFPoXDnfgwAAFr9:20130724211527:s

a base model Honda Civic Sedan is 18k and change. A Honda Civic Sedan Hybrid is 24k and change.

Thats 6k.

I mean people buy bikes that cost more than 6k, right?

Depending on how much you drive and how you drive, its not out of the question that you can justify the incremental 6k. Especially if you think gas prices are going to increase. and even more if you add a small amount to your personal cost benefit for the emissions difference.

[dasgeh]

My problem with hybrids is that people use them to justify driving more. Driving more has negative externalities beyond emissions. I just saw a great article on the cost of congestion… now where was it?

[lordofthemark]

“The missing wheel covers, a couple cigarette burns on the interior”

there are Prius drivers who SMOKE?

[Author]

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