Petition for WMATA to add a bike car to every 3rd train/8 car train

[elbows]

Being at work, I cannot look at the petition now, but why not ask them to come up with a more bike-friendly policy in other ways?

To me, holding my bike on the metro does not bother as much as:

1) not being able to take my bike on metro when going against the rush during rushour and
2) being forced to use the slow and smelly elevators for which there is often a line when giant strollers are allowed on escalators and I am a lot more mobile on the escalator with my bike AND many stations lack working elevators and those that day usually require multiple trips on escalators.

[cyclingfool]

@elbows 91859 wrote:

Being at work, I cannot look at the petition now, but why not ask them to come up with a more bike-friendly policy in other ways?

To me, holding my bike on the metro does not bother as much as:

1) not being able to take my bike on metro when going against the rush during rushour and
2) being forced to use the slow and smelly elevators for which there is often a line when giant strollers are allowed on escalators and I am a lot more mobile on the escalator with my bike AND many stations lack working elevators and those that day usually require multiple trips on escalators.

FWIW, strollers aren’t supposed to be on escalators either. That’s more a question of enforcement than official policy.

I generally agree about the reverse commute. It would be nice to allow bikes on the reverse commute trains. There could be issues where a reverse commute becomes a non-reverse commute route that would have to be addressed, e.g., taking orange train from New Carrollton to Vienna at rush hour.

[peterw_diy]

Sounds like y’all should buy folding bikes, since they’re always allowed. BTW, strollers are not supposed to be used on Metro escalators, especially unfolded.

[Raymo853]

If there was a petition for keeping the rush hour ban, I would sign that. Sorry bikes have no place on crowded metros. Comparing them to baby strollers is simply wrong. And expecting the metro folks to monitor who is trying on an opposite to rush train in stations with combined entrances (all) and combined platforms (most) is not practicable. Also, most metros inside dc are stuffed both directions.

And pointing out the stories about empty cars when so many people have experience being stuffed into cars or having to wait for the next train is wrong.

Yes I wish metro was efficient enough to allow a bike, baby buggy, large object car on every train at all times, but it isn’t and never will be.

[skins_brew]

I will sign it, but I think this is a pipe dream.

Metro is a decent system, it could be better, but I think they are going to look at this from the “We have much bigger things to worry about.”

Also, during the rush on certain lines, people are so crammed into cars I simply cannot see getting bike involved, even in the last car.

One thing WMATA should look into if making the current cars more bike friendly. Often times, there isn’t even anywhere to put a bike…

[KWL]

@skins_brew 91893 wrote:

One thing WMATA should look into if making the current cars more bike friendly. Often times, there isn’t even anywhere to put a bike…

It can be done. http://www.trimet.org/howtoride/bikes/bikesonmax.htm

[n18]

I once took the train from Ballston to Vienna at 3:30 PM weekday, and regretted it. It was too crowded for my taste.

[mstone]

This is one issue where cyclists really can come across as myopic and self-centered. The bottom line is that metro is capacity constrained at peak; WMATA has no interest in replacing 6 or 8 customers with one bike, and doing so is not a good thing for the system overall. So the perception is that cyclists are willing to inconvenience everyone else on a rush hour train line because simply don’t want to do anything else but ride a bike (except, of course, for the fraction of the trip where they’re standing and holding the bike). And before anyone says anything about strollers, please be aware that nothing will make you seem more looney and less likely to win a debate in the public eye than appearing to argue that your bike is as important as a small human.

[skins_brew]

@KWL 91917 wrote:

It can be done. http://www.trimet.org/howtoride/bikes/bikesonmax.htm

Yeap, I think the Boston system has something similar. I am headed to Portland in two days. I cannot wait to ride out there!

Even during non rush hour times, some metro trains have enough people where bringing a bike on will make things uncomfortable for the simple reason that there is no where to put a bike.

[Kbikeva]

Purchasing a folding bike is not within a lot of peoples’ budgets.

Bikes being treated as legitimate parts of the transportation system is important.

Not wanting to be myopic. Wanting them to do the research and answer the mail. It is possible to design/improve a system that accounts for bikes as well.

If you don’t agree, you don’t need to sign it. If no one ever asks them these questions, they will continue to marginalize bike/mass trans commuters.

[Raymo853]

@mstone 91950 wrote:

This is one issue where cyclists really can come across as myopic and self-centered. And before anyone says anything about strollers, please be aware that nothing will make you seem more looney and less likely to win a debate in the public eye than appearing to argue that your bike is as important as a small human.

I have also seen cycling advocates claim if wheelchairs are allowed then bikes should be at a WMATA meeting. I’ve also seen that phrase on these boards, in reference to an apartment building banning bikes from the lobby entrance.

[mstone]

@Kbikeva 91961 wrote:

Bikes being treated as legitimate parts of the transportation system is important.[/quote]

Bikes are being treated as legitimate parts of the transportation system. WMATA is making an effort to expand bike parking at the stations, just as they have car parking at stations. Do cars need to be allowed on metro before they’re considered legitimate, or is legitimacy perhaps actually decoupled from being allowed on metro?

Quote:

Not wanting to be myopic. Wanting them to do the research and answer the mail. It is possible to design/improve a system that accounts for bikes as well.

Of course it’s possible. The question is whether it makes sense for metro to put its resources there when there are so many other pressing needs (most of them honestly much more pressing). The only arguments I’ve seen in favor of that are that 1) it makes things more convenient for a tiny fraction of metro users (it can’t be more than a tiny fraction, right? advocates have to say that it would only be a few bikes because everyone knows there isn’t much room) (note that the convenience increase for a few cyclists is balanced by the convenience decrease for anyone who gets smacked by a dirty bike) and that 2) it could increase metro ridership by a tiny fraction. If it’s a complicated rule (certain directions at certain times) then it’ll require enforcement that metro’s station managers seem entirely unable to perform. If it’s just “anyone do anything” then metro has to deal with the non-cyclists who are negatively affected and pissed off. If it’s reconfiguring trains, then that needs to come out of the existing budget. (Do we defer more maintenance or scale back the upgrades to 8 car trains?)

Quote:

If you don’t agree, you don’t need to sign it. If no one ever asks them these questions, they will continue to marginalize bike/mass trans commuters.

People have asked the questions. The questions get asked really, really often. People just don’t like the answer and keep hoping that if they ask it enough they’ll get a new answer.

[CPTJohnC]

@mstone 91950 wrote:

nothing will make you seem more looney and less likely to win a debate in the public eye than appearing to argue that your bike is as important as a small human.

How about huge rolling suitcases, duffel bags, etc… all of which are permitted at all times? Yes, I have kids. But I don’t think strollers (or bikes) have much place on crowded metro. There are much better solutions for moving kids in and around transit.

[lordofthemark]

@mstone 91950 wrote:

This is one issue where cyclists really can come across as myopic and self-centered. The bottom line is that metro is capacity constrained at peak; WMATA has no interest in replacing 6 or 8 customers with one bike, and doing so is not a good thing for the system overall. So the perception is that cyclists are willing to inconvenience everyone else on a rush hour train line because simply don’t want to do anything else but ride a bike (except, of course, for the fraction of the trip where they’re standing and holding the bike). And before anyone says anything about strollers, please be aware that nothing will make you seem more looney and less likely to win a debate in the public eye than appearing to argue that your bike is as important as a small human.

In general I agree with you on this but.

A IIUC BART in SF does allow bikes on at all times. Not sure how it works out but it does. There is definitely reverse commute capacity on many WMATA lines even at rush hour. I realize policing to make sure cyclists only used it in designated directions would be difficult. Not 100% certain its not feasible
B. The current times and rules often lead to absurdity. I was once riding on July 4th. I found myself at King Street Station, with my bike, having just missed a bus back to Annandale (I did not want to ride from KSS to Annandale) I decided to take my bike on the metro to Springfield, and take the FFX connector bus from there – easy – peasy, right? It was about 4 PM. “no bikes on the metro on July 4th” sure, it would be crazy to be taking your bike through Smithsonian metro that day. But I doubt many people were taking the Blue line sbound from KSS at that time. Probably even Smithsonian wasn’t that crowded yet.
C. You are supposed to take your kid out and fold the stroller while on metro. Just like on an airplane. Its a transportation device, not a portable seat. I won’t bring that up as a cyclist (heaven knows that would lead to more abuse of cyclists) but as a metro rider I would.

Note, all of that said, I am okay with current rules (bikes allowed offpeak, and folding bikes at all times) My priorities from metro as a rider are more bike parking, and better access/routes (where that is on metro property) And to improve bike on bus operations (bikes are legal on bus bike racks at all times) – some bus operators appear confused as to which of the two racks should be used when only one bike is using them.

[mstone]

@lordofthemark 92870 wrote:

A IIUC BART in SF does allow bikes on at all times. Not sure how it works out but it does.[/quote]

Actually, they don’t. Bikes are not permitted on “crowded trains”. So, basically, not on any rush hour train. How does it work out? I dunno, maybe there are fewer entitled type-A personalities in SF? At times I’m all flowers and unicorns and I think “sure, people could be trusted not to be asshats about bringing their bikes onto trains” and then I wake up, remember where I am, and laugh. BART also reconfigured their trains to provide a bike area, and even before then the area near the doors was more open. WMATA has toyed with putting in fewer seats, but they generally get the feedback that people would rather have more seats and screw the additional capacity for standing (or bikes or whatever). On metro it’s certainly more practical to get a bike onto one of the newer cars than one of the older cars, but there’s no guarantee you’ll see one on a given trip.

@CPTJohnC 92868 wrote:

How about huge rolling suitcases, duffel bags, etc… all of which are permitted at all times?

Are you actually seeing many suitcases the size of a 700c road bike? Or are they more the size of a folded bike, which is allowed on at any time? Sure there’s always the apocryphal story of the guys bringing the refrigerator onto the train, but this doesn’t seem to be an actual problem in real life. Suitcases also generally don’t have pointy, muddy, and greasy things sticking out of them so people are less concerned if a suitcase bumps into them.

Again, it’s not really helping the cause to be all like, “this one time, I saw a woman with a rolling carry on bag, and my bike is totally the same thing” (because people with think you’re a wacko). Nor is it helpful to be all like, “this one time I saw this dude with a 6 foot model of the iron throne, with swords and all, so my bike should also be allowed on the metro” (because, why would anyone hearing a story of stupid things on the metro think that’s a good reason to bring more things on the metro). The key is to focus on convincing the skeptical that everyone in the DC area with a bike can be relied on to be responsible and not try to cram it onto a crowded platform or train, rather than finding analogies to other things that are allowed on metro (which the skeptical may or may not like anyway). Good luck with that.

[Author]

Posts