On E-Bikes…

[Brendan von Buckingham]

@dasgeh 122436 wrote:

Where do you get that 15mph is an average bike speed? I have a speedometer and on the Custis (the east side, before all the blind curves), I regularly ride 16-18mph and I’m around average. And as to your last point, have you ridden a fully loaded cargo bike? It’s a HTFU argument, and those really need to stop when talking about transportational riding.

Moreover, just because there’s a motor doesn’t mean you can’t go slower. Too unsafe to go fast? Brake. The stories of newbies getting ebikes and riding slowly at first support this point: there’s no need to design for the new cyclist — that person can easily feel the dangers of speed and just brake. Unlike in a car, where you’re surrounded by a bubble, you’re completely aware of your speed (even without a speedometer) on an ebike.

I’m curious: have you ever ridden an ebike? What type (Stromer-esque/hybrid bike with motor or cargo bike or something else)?

I don’t really care that much about this topic, but…

15, 16, 17, 18; yes they’re all about average.
I’ve not ridden a cargo bike or ebike. Most haven’t.
A fully loaded cargo bike sounds like it weighs a lot. Heavy, fast things can often be more dangerous than light, slow things. It’s worth considering how to control or limit dangerous things. Very dangerous? Lots of control. A little dangrous? Some control. I don’t know how dangerous a motor-driven or motor-assisted cargo bike might be, but it sounds heavier and faster than a regular bicycle.
No one without a speedometer can be completely aware of their speed. I simply believe that the heavier and faster a vehicle is, the more reasonable it is that the operator be equipped with a speedometer.

Didn’t mean to make you defensive.

[mstone]

@DismalScientist 122459 wrote:

I don’t want to be passing a car on a two lane road in a car with a governor. The speed limit be damned.

Luckily it’s possible to not pass…

[chris_s]

@mstone 122471 wrote:

Luckily it’s possible to not pass…

…and when nobody can exceed the speed limit, everyone is likely to be going the speed limit. Who needs passing?

[DCLiz]

I was just looking up DC regulations on Segways (yes, they are allowed in bike lanes). It seems that e-assist bikes are not, though. Am I reading this correctly? Does that seem odd? http://ddot.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/dmv/publication/attachments/May%2017%202013%20Non-traditional%20Motor%20Vehicle%20chart.pdf

[americancyclo]

I’ll offer this strava ride up for ebike comment.
[TABLE=”class: unstyled”]
[TR]
[TH][/TH]
[TH]Avg[/TH]
[TH]Max[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TH]Speed[/TH]
[TD]11.7mi/h[/TD]
[TD]28.0mi/h[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Rcannon saw us and can comment whether or not me and my four year old were a hazard to other trail users.
https://www.strava.com/activities/376021236/overview

[83b]

The statutory language says: “Except as otherwise permitted for a motor vehicle, no person shall operate a motorized bicycle on any sidewalk or any off-street bikepath or bicycle route within the District. This prohibition shall apply even though the motorized bicycle is being operated solely by human power.”

It seems that the chart DC has put together assumes that any bike lane is an “off-street bikepath or bicycle route.” However I don’t think this language is particularly clear, especially when you consider the types of infrastructure we have. For example, the Met Branch trail seems to obviously be an off-street bikepath. But what about the 15th Street cycletrack or other protected bike lanes?

And it’s not particularly clear if “off-street” modifies both “bikepath” and “bicycle route.” If it does, then it seems that a simple painted right side bike lane wouldn’t be covered by this prohibition. And even if it doesn’t, is a simple bike lane a “bike route”? I can’t find a statutory definition for the term.

FWIW, I’m going to continue riding my ebike in all types of bike infrastructure, since I consider that to be both considerably safer for me and the more logical place for me to be. Drivers don’t understand the distinction and go positively bonkers when they see us not using bike infrastructure that’s been provided. How long do people think I could go riding down Penn Ave everyday at 20mph taking a full lane before getting, in order, (i) honked at, (ii) yelled at, (iii) ticketed, (iv) assaulted, (v) assaulted with a vehicle, (v) hit by a vehicle. My guesses (i) first day, (ii) first week, (iii) first month, (iv) first quarter, (v) first semester, (v) within a year.

[dasgeh]

I just looked at the chart, but it seems that (1) the DC laws on motor-driven cycles conflict with the federal statutes, because they impose requirements on ebikes depending on how they’re operated. Ugh. and (2) ebikes could arguably be PMDs, though probably not because of the “no tandem wheels” requirement. and (3) family bikes don’t meet the definition of motor-driven cycles, because there’s no seatpost for some of the riders. So what are those?

Overall, though, this is just silly.

[mstone]

@dasgeh 122887 wrote:

don’t meet the definition of motor-driven cycles, because there’s no seatpost for some of the riders. So what are those?

What are they? A huge opportunity to ride through loopholes like a boss!

[kcb203]

Whatever the rule is, I don’t think a solar powered, enclosed e-trike should be allowed on the trails because it’s so wide and blocks visibility so much. I’ve seen one of these several times recently around Vienna on the W&OD.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]9442[/ATTACH]

[dasgeh]

@kcb203 122917 wrote:

Whatever the rule is, I don’t think a solar powered, enclosed e-trike should be allowed on the trails because it’s so wide and blocks visibility so much. I’ve seen one of these several times recently around Vienna on the W&OD.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]9442[/ATTACH]

Fair enough, but if the issue is width, then why shouldn’t the ban be on ANY bike that’s wider than X (which should be at least 36″, because plenty of trailers are at least that wide)?

[mstone]

@dasgeh 122918 wrote:

Fair enough, but if the issue is width, then why shouldn’t the ban be on ANY bike that’s wider than X (which should be at least 36″, because plenty of trailers are at least that wide)?

Why add new bans when the motorized vehicle ban easily covers such excess? 😎

[Rod Smith]

Only if he lets me skitch.

[Author]

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