Nutrition and longer rides

[lordofthemark]

Up till last weekend, I pretty much did not think about nutrition on rides – I made sure to have a full water bottle and to replenish it at stops, and basically ate when I was hungry – nothing real heavy, but no particular attention to whether it was carbs, or protein or whatever. I generally do not drink sugared drinks (my blood sugar tests at the bottom of the pre-diabetic range, so while I am not religious about the restrictions, there are some things I avoid or minimize) but on a long ride on the W&OD will get a smoothie at Green Lizard. When I get a beer, I limit myself to a pint at most, or just a sample size, to avoid dehydration (and other effects of alcohol ). And that is it.

But riding over 90 miles (and while still near the bottom of the strava rankings, relatively fast for me), I think I need to pay more attention. I was okay for the first 75 miles or so, but by that point (past Reston on the return down the W&OD) I was feeling a little shaky – like I needed something, maybe electrolytes? Maybe carbs? Definitely not a “meal”. I basically have never eaten “sports food” and haven’t had a gatorade or sports drink in years, but when I got to the Vienna Whole Foods, I decided to look around, and settled on a Cliff bar, which hit the spot – I felt better on the ride home. (note, prior to that the last solid nutrition I had had was an egg and cheese sandwich on the way out in Leesburg at round noon – and then a half pint of beer at Old Ox around 3:30, and I hit WF at around 5:30, so it probably was time for a meal, but somehow I did not want one)

Should I worry more electrolytes? Drink a sports drink? Get some kind of gel? Just keep some Cliff bars with me? What is the physiology here, and how should I use it to my advantage?

Topic

[huskerdont]

I find I can usually go about 50 with just water, but if going longer or if it’s offroad, I usually do one bottle with water and one with a recovery drink (or one bottle with one and a Camelbak with the other if really long). When I did that W&OD ride you did to make my first century, I had both and needed both (took about 8 hours). I used Cytomax, but I think there are ones out there with less or even no sugar. I just picked up some Hammer HEED, which uses Stevia and is supposed to not be too sweet. We’ll see.

https://www.westernbikeworks.com/product/hammer-nutrition-heed-32-servings

Ingredients: Maltodextrin, Xylitol, Natural Flavor, Calcium Chelate, Potassium Chelate, Magnesium Chelate, Salt, L-Carnosine, Stevia, Glycine, Tyrosine, Manganese Chelate, Chromium Polynicotinate.

By the way, Xylitol is not good for some people’s guts and is toxic to dogs. I haven’t ever had a problem with it.

[Tania]

You’re going to have to find what works best for YOU, but on longer rides (maybe upwards of two hours), I always have food to eat and/or calories in my water.

I did a flat century on Sat and I ate one bag of honey stinger gummies, one pack of shot blocs, a small handful of sesame sticks, half an orange, and a banana, plus some cytomax in my water bottles. I find when it’s hot (and it was!) or a hard effort I don’t WANT to eat but I try to eat on a schedule (again, you’ll have to find what works for you).

• Races of an hour or less – I don’t bring food, maybe some electrolytes in my water.
• Non-racing longer rides – I lean more towards eating rather than drinking my calories (because I can!).
• Longer races (more than one hour) I’ll put a good amount of calories in my water. I use Hammer – a mix of Heed and Sustained Energy. People seem to either love Hammer or hate it, it works really well for me so I use it. I’ll still have gummies in my top tube bag and pop one every 15-20 minutes just to keep the calories coming in. The last thing I want to do in a race is bonk.

So, experiment!

Full disclosure – I don’t think I ate enough on this last century. The heat zapped my appetite and at the end of the ride, someone had to physically help me off my bike (mostly due to heat exhaustion but I’m sure my blood sugar had tanked by that point).

[huskerdont]

+1 to Tania’s point, you really have to experiment to find what works for you. I used gels in a marathon and felt they made me, um, sick, but some swear by them. I find that a Powerbar-type thingy doesn’t work fast enough to keep me from bonking. Sometimes an order of french fries is what does the trick; sugar just isn’t always the thing I need. But a sports drink can at least help.

[LeprosyStudyGroup]

~Obligatory I’m an armchair semi-interested idiot on the internet, not an expert caveat~
What I’ve come across is that muscles and red blood cells store energy in the form of glycogen which is basically the first thing your body converts through contact with oxygen into simple glucose (sugar) to burn for energy during exercise. Having some form of sugar, the simpler to digest the better, in your belly keeps your glycogen levels “topped off” for longer. The depletion of glycogen in your blood and muscles is what leads to “bonking”, or that famous wall of energy loss you can get in endurance exercise. You can think of your heart and red blood supply as basically your first and most important muscle for endurance cycling, it’s why things like EPO, blood doping, altitude training, Froome or Lance’s abnormally gigantic tickers exist in the pros.

How you do this is highly personal, eating while riding makes a lot of people queasy, I find that eating a clif bar about once an hour if I plan on going relatively long or hard works for me. (bonus that they’re vegan?) I haven’t been on any rides longer than 4 hours without stopping and I’m not a racer either.

[lordofthemark]

@Tania 141401 wrote:

I find when it’s hot (and it was!) or a hard effort I don’t WANT to eat but I try to eat on a schedule (again, you’ll have to find what works for you).

I guess this is what got to me. I do not ride (ever?) more than 2 hours without stopping, and usually get at least a light meal every 3 to 4 hours or so. I guess I normally would have either stopped at GL for a snack, or RTC for a light meal, on the way back from Purcellvill. Having already stopped at Old Ox I did not want to stop again so soon, and the heat made me disinclined to eat even a light meal. And then from Reston to Vienna there really is not any place to get food close to the trail.

I think in the future on rides that long, especially on warm days, I will take a snack along. Is a Clif bar a “power bar”? Seems like this kind of thing is a way to get a fair amount of calories without a lot of weight or bulk.

[KLizotte]

If it is warm out I really like juicy kinds of fruit (clementines, grapes, watermelon). Satisfies the need for something sweet, food, and hydration all at once.

I prefer to avoid Gatorade and its ilk. I like a homemade mix of filtered water, coconut water, and pineapple juice (adjust amounts to your taste). All natural and provides potassium and electrolytes replacement. A pinch of salt can be added if you are going to be out for a really long time and sweating a lot.

Fig newtons and KIND granola bars work well for basic sustenance.

[Emm]

Yep, see what works for you. Everyone is different. I need carbs (including some heavier ones) and potassium for longer rides or I get sick. Some people like my husband can survive fully on sports gels for 100 mile rides. Another friend swears by coconut water and dried sweet potatoes. I recommend packing a few items, and experimenting to see what works and keeps you happy.

If it helps, I spent last summer experimenting alot with food, and I came up with the following plan which works really well for me, but it did involve alot of trial and error and a few times almost puking on the side of the W&OD: I begin with 1/2 Gatorade and 1/2 ice for my first water bottle or two, and move to 3/4ths to 100% Gatorade after ~50 miles (earlier on really hot days). I try to drink a bottle every ~25 miles if not more. For rides over 50 miles I also pack a banana, cereal bar or two, and 1/2 a pb&j if it’s going to be over 70 miles. I’ll stop at 50-75 miles for a smoothie or something cold and sugary usually, and eat the pb&j then.

The key thing in my case is I need to remember to eat before I feel hungry. Once the hunger really hits I’m screwed and can never seem to fully recover. That means for rides over 50 miles a banana gets eaten at 20-25 miles, and then every 10-20 miles thereafter I need to eat something, even if its just 1/2 a cereal bar or a gel.

[DrP]

I agree with the others in that whatever works for you is best.
Typically I do long rides with a friend. I need water, no matter what the temperature and my friend needs food (bars, dried fruit, cookies, whatever is available).

In my first 80 mile rides, I forced myself to have a Kind bar half-way through and possibly a second for the last 10miles or so (I prefer the fruit and nuts (never the ones with chocolate – chocolate is something to be savored) with little else to all the stuff that is considered nutrition – yep, a purist in that sense). Now I am able to eat more while riding, but usually only on a >4hr ride will I force myself to have a Kind bar. I am not sure I have ever “bonked”. Sure, I might get slow a bit, then stop, stand up, have some water, and get back on the bike and be good for a while. However, I am not racing. I am probably doing a 12-14mph pace on the hybrid overall (faster downhill and much slower up, usually).

My friend now takes more liquids after all the riding with me (“drink more water, you will need it!”), but still not much. Our stops are usually one who drinks and one who eats. Same ride, different nutritional needs.

[huskerdont]

Interesting that so many can use light foods. I find that any light food just makes me ravenous and worse. So, a banana for me is counterproductive, but French fries will do the trick (pity they’re never available race-side). I do slices of cheese with crackers on long kayak trips, and that seems to work. Everyone different.

[Tim Kelley]

@huskerdont 141410 wrote:

ut French fries will do the trick (pity they’re never available race-side).

Roasted new potatoes, tossed with olive oil, sea salt, and some rosemary, in a ziplock. Yum!

[creadinger]

The great thing about the W&OD is that there are so many good food options with which you can experiment. 7-11s are great places to stop just for the sheer variety of stuff to eat, even though the quality may be suspect. As other threads have shown there are a ton of convenient restaurants too.

I tried doing perpetuem and the liquid food diet for a couple of years, but it just didn’t work for me. I’d be ok for 100 miles, but after that I was too nauseated to eat anything and thus would limp the final 25 miles home on every 200K. Not good and I got tired of it. So now I try to eat whatever suits. Sugary stuff initially because your body craves it, then I switch to more salty foods like potato chips, V8, pizza, as sugar begins to get really gross. I eat occasional Clif Shot Blox or a Gu for the fast carbs. At 7-11s I like the fresh fruit cups because they give a boost of sugar, without being too sugary, especially the citrus ones. Peaches, watermelon, etc…

Yeah, like everyone said it’s all up to what your body will accept. Riding centuries in summer weather is tough as you try to figure out why you feel like shit. Is it the heat? Am I hungry? Dehydrated? Low on sugar? Or maybe I’m just beat from a long week. Unfortunately it’s a slow process and may require you to find yourself sitting on a bench 40 miles from home with an upset stomach having just vomited sports drink wondering what the f*&k you’re doing. But, you’ll get home eventually and learn from it, and be better off next ride.

Forgot to mention that Naked drinks in convenience stores are pretty much like a smoothie, and have 300+ calories/bottle. It’s blended up fruit and stuff so it’s better than a soda right?

[Tim Kelley]

Obligatory link for the Feed Zone:

http://www.velopress.com/books/the-feed-zone-cookbook/

https://feedzonecookbook.com/portables/

[vern]

Subby and I went on an 80 mile ride the final day of Freezing Saddles fueled by muffins and coffee. It worked that day, but I don’t know that I’d recommend it.

[lordofthemark]

1. It seems from the above, that most folks rely on snacks, bars, drinks, etc the entire ride and never sit down for a meal. Is that correct? My roundtrip on the W&OD took 12 hours, about 8 in the saddle. Not sure not having a “meal” all day is a good strategy. Of course I could try go faster (note I am riding a hybrid)

2. I am have a hard time with the notion of drinking my calories (beer aside) or taking too much as simple carbs – years of changing habits that helped me lose weight (I used to be obese) and my concern about my blood sugar. I feel comfortable with the idea of cliff bars – seem to have a fair amount of fibers compared to sugars, a fair amount of unsat fat vs sat fat, and a general mix of nutrients, and some potassium.

[huskerdont]

@lordofthemark 141425 wrote:

1. It seems from the above, that most folks rely on snacks, bars, drinks, etc the entire ride and never sit down for a meal. Is that correct? My roundtrip on the W&OD took 12 hours, about 8 in the saddle. Not sure not having a “meal” all day is a good strategy.

Probably have to distinguish between racing and touring there. Some are talking about racing, but if touring, then a meal would be more appropriate. You could view 90 miles on the W&OD as stage of a tour. And if you have blood sugar issues, you might need to go the meal route, in addition to the snacks and bars. You know your body best.

[Author]

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