N+1? Do I need one? I want one…

[hozn]

@huskerdont 137509 wrote:

Steel may corrode, but aluminum breaks. I’ve broken two aluminum frames over the years, and have never gone back to it.

I also have a 1965 Schwinn Varsity that doesn’t have any rust. The bearings in the bracket were frozen in place, but the frame was fine.

Several bike materials to chose from, and none of them are wrong.

Steel breaks too. I broke my steel MTB, cracked at the BB shell — didn’t realize it was broken until I was replacing crankset one day. I haven’t broken an aluminum frame yet.

(Titanium breaks too, I’ve learned twice now.)

[dkel]

@hozn 137508 wrote:

All I know is that my steel bikes (which have been 2/3 mountain bikes) always got nicks in the paint and always rusted wherever there was exposed metal.

I heard somewhere that a small chip will accumulate a surface of corrosion, and then stop rusting; thereafter, that surface rust will then protect the spot from corroding further. I don’t know if that’s true or not, but the ’84 Schwinn I built up into a fixie had a couple such spots that seemed pretty stable. In a similar vein, I was underneath Citizens’ Bridge in Falls Church the other day, and noticed that it is totally coated with rust. I can’t imagine that was a materials oversight in the design and construction of the bridge, nor can I imagine that they plan to let it rust out (or replace it, for that matter!). In any case, @hozn is correct, steel does rust; in very small amounts, I imagine it’s not that serious a problem. That said, I would be suspicious of rust that grows underneath paint, and also rust in welded joints.

@GovernorSilver 137510 wrote:

Surly and All-City both put “ED coating” on their steel frames. Maybe all the QBP companies do that – not sure. I’m guessing this is not the same as Framesaver.

The inside of the Straggler’s tubes definitely have a finished feel to them; I’m sure that’s the electro-deposited coating they treat it with before they put the hott purple glitter on (BTW, that bike comes in toothpaste green now. Blecch!). They still recommend applying Frame Saver.

[AFHokie]

@dkel 137514 wrote:

I heard somewhere that a small chip will accumulate a surface of corrosion, and then stop rusting; thereafter, that surface rust will then protect the spot from corroding further. I don’t know if that’s true or not, but the ’84 Schwinn I built up into a fixie had a couple such spots that seemed pretty stable. In a similar vein, I was underneath Citizens’ Bridge in Falls Church the other day, and noticed that it is totally coated with rust. I can’t imagine that was a materials oversight in the design and construction of the bridge, nor can I imagine that they plan to let it rust out (or replace it, for that matter!). In any case, @hozn is correct, steel does rust; in very small amounts, I imagine it’s not that serious a problem. That said, I would be suspicious of rust that grows underneath paint, and also rust in welded joints.

That’s what occurs with aluminum & copper. Iron/steel will keep oxidizing until it disintegrates.

From Wikipedia’s definition of Rust: Given sufficient time, oxygen, and water, any iron mass will eventually convert entirely to rust and disintegrate. It provides no protection to the underlying iron, unlike the formation of patina on copper surfaces.

Similar to copper, with aluminum a thin layer of aluminum oxide forms on any exposed aluminum surface and protects the metal from further oxidation.

You’re ’84 Schwinn may be a type of stainless steel which (also from wiki) forms a layer of chromium(III) oxide that then acts in a similar manner to aluminum oxide. There are also various steel alloys that inhibit rust, but they will still continue to rust (at a much slower rate) until disintegration

[dkel]

I guess I should be worried about that bridge, then…

[consularrider]

@hozn 137508 wrote:

All I know is that my steel bikes (which have been 2/3 mountain bikes) always got nicks in the paint and always rusted wherever there was exposed metal. E.g. the dropouts (sliding dropouts) and around the set screws for said dropouts on my Voodoo, paint nicks on my jabberwocky. On my SE Lager the dropouts were the only significant exposed metal and they were rusty.

In short, whatever you were doing to keep your exposed steel from rusting must have been working!

Edit: to be fair, it may have taken a couple years for rust to take hold. I didn’t really keep track of timeline there. It’s just a consideration: steel rusts.

I’m riding a steel 1984 Raleigh road bike (13,000 from me the second owner), a steel 1994 Raleigh rigid mtb (25,000 miles), a steel 2009 Salsa road bike (22,000 miles), a steel 2014 Kona Rove (7,500 miles), and a steel 2015 Surly Pugsley fat bike (250 miles, anyone see a pattern here?). All of the bikes have been ridden in wet, cold, and salt and none have rusted out. I don’t baby my bikes and don’t worry about their cosmetic nicks and small scrapes. The only non-steel bike I’ve had was a 2009 Giant Transend aluminum frame, and that’s the one whose frame cracked at just over 20,000 miles.

My point is buy what you like and ride what you buy.

[hozn]

Yeah, consularrider is right. Ride what you like. And I haven’t had a bike rust out/through (have had set screws rust into the frame, that was annoying). I am just not a fan of the rust spots on the frame and couldn’t but feel I need to do something to address them.

Raw ti or carbon is definitely my first choice. I will just keep running through Chinese ti — or carbon frames, I guess. I find it hard to find equivalent value elsewhere.

Edit:
I would only add that there are definitely some great bikes made of steel — talking about geometry, style, etc. I imagine I will definitely buy another steel MTB someday.

So just buy what you like and ide the hell out it.

[Steve O]

@dkel 137521 wrote:

I guess I should be worried about that bridge, then…

Better to be on it than under it, though, I would think.

[vvill]

If I had a commute that long I wouldn’t want something too heavy. I’d probably go for something like a gravel/CX bike. Agree that DC Used is a great source of used bikes/parts, although in the case that you’re not too sure what you want it may be worth test riding some and saving for what you want. Although it’s always what you think you want, and then later you want something else anyway, so, yeah…

I was, like you and eminva, in a similar situation after primarily riding my road bike for commute purposes. I restricted my budget (and stayed with new-only bikes because I wanted a disc brake CX bike) and got an aluminum Kona Jake but in hindsight I sort of wish I’d gone for a nicer bike (although Kona didn’t have any nicer disc brake frames that model year, and I also didn’t want something that would be a thief magnet). It’s nearing 4500 miles now – not really that many but a lot of those have been in CX races and gravel events/rides (where you tend to rack up mileage slower, but the miles are harder on you and your bike), and as a not-so-built person I definitely appreciate lighter bikes on those rides – enough so that at this point in time I would like a lighter bike now with crisper shifting. I did swap the stock shifters up for 105 on that bike but it’s still not as nice as the Ultegra I have on my road bike. Having ridden more bikes and terrain since getting that bike, I do notice the particular strengths of my CX bike (it’s a little more relaxed than true race CX geometry, and works best as a sturdy commuter, as well as being hardy enough for light singletrack), whereas when I first got it I saw it more as just a heavier less-sprightly road bike (that was admittedly great for gravel). Back then I was not sure how much CX/gravel/etc. riding I was going to do on that bike but if I had known, I would’ve gotten carbon or Ti – it would be worth the cost.

On the steel debate I can’t really say. I’m yet to ever break a frame and in any case I only have one steel bike (I do tend to baby it a bit in bad weather, mostly because it’s a nicely painted lugged steel frame that I will never run fenders on.) Steel doesn’t have to be heavy, although light “exotic” steels are going to be expensive of course. I do think that your size, power, riding style, etc. will affect your frame longevity. If you ride long endurance rides instead of say, lots of intense MTB rides on a frame I suspect it will last for a lot more miles.

[dkel]

@Steve O 137525 wrote:

Better to be on it than under it, though, I would think.

If it collapses, better to be nowhere near it!

[rcannon100]

Started with a Cannondale Bad Boy. An excellent commuter bike that takes a beating. Its like commuting on a pick-up truck.

[IMG]http://www.cannondale.com/en/~/media/Images/Dorel/Cannondale/Global/Bikes/CM2014-CM2014LG02/images/C15_CM2014_02_BBQ_8.ashx?mw=946&mh=630[/IMG]

Last year N+1 Green Bike. Green bike has resulted in dramatically improved performance. Longer distance. Faster. Taller. I have truly enjoyed Green Bike.

So here is the question. If I saw a huge improvement moving from a commuter city bike to a CX bike ~ would I see improvement moving to an adventure / endurance bike? I mean I know I have to train harder if I ever want to play with the big kids and play hooky on Fridays. But is an adventure / endurance bike gonna help me with range and ability to ride.

I love the Green Bike. It has improved my riding ability significantly. What I love the most is good long rides. The C&O. Gap. Even, if I have to, the WOD. I want a bike I can just ride.

So if I get an adventure bike – how different would it be from a CX bike. Is it marketing fluff? Will I feel as much difference I feel between the CX and the commuter? Will I be able to ride to Pittsburgh and back?? Will I be able to beat Tim up hills??

[sethpo]

Yes.

[DismalScientist]

Don’t let the Freds fool you. The only real difference between an adventure bike and a cross bike is bottom bracket height. Just get racier tires.

[mstone]

No.

[TwoWheelsDC]

@DismalScientist 139411 wrote:

Don’t let the Freds fool you. The only real difference between an adventure bike and a cross bike is bottom bracket height. Just get racier tires.

I…..actually agree with this.

[dkel]

@DismalScientist 139411 wrote:

Don’t let the Freds fool you. The only real difference between an adventure bike and a cross bike is bottom bracket height. Just get racier tires.

The voice of reason.

Who the hell knew????

[Author]

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