My Other Bike Is A….

[rcannon100]

As I understand it from my data gurus (former Pew Research folk), you just have to have a statistically valid base and be able to compensate for strong variables and determine weak variables. It is an art form.

[DaveK]

@vvill 42861 wrote:

I would much rather drive alone than carpool, but that’s me.

Same. I intensely dislike my fellow man.

Outside of you folks of course, you’re all great.

[TwoWheelsDC]

@rcannon100 42854 wrote:

Anyone else notice that the rail is “light rail”? Metro is heavy rail, as are most “subway” systems. I guess it’s because this study is from Portland, which only has a light rail streetcar system AFAIK, but it would be interesting to see if there was a difference in happiness levels between heavy rail commuters and light rail commuters. If DC ever gets the streetcar running, we might eventually see some data…

[CPTJohnC]

@rcannon100 42689 wrote:

Okay, so lets take for me what I see all the time – the CJ bridge.

Wow- you’re old-school. It hasn’t been the Cabin John Bridge since the 80s

@rcannon100 42689 wrote:

These are morons commuting from MD to VA or from VA to MD. We start with the problem of why you dont live where you work – but that is a different discussion.

Hmmm– judgmental much? There are lots of ‘non-moronic’ reasons people might not live and work in close proximity. The vast majority of people who work in the district don’t live here, and never could. But as for the VA/MD dichotomy:

If there are 2 of you (say, spouses?) it isn’t always possible for both to get jobs in the same place, so you have to either choose to live close to one’s work and far from the other or live ‘in the middle’ which can lead to living and working on opposite sides of the river.

People change jobs far more easily (in many cases) than changing living arrangements.

Once one invests in a home, giving that up when changing jobs isn’t always super simple, esp. in the economy of the past 5 years.

Employers move work locations and it isn’t usually possible to changing living arrangements instantly.

Some folks work out of multiple offices or worksites.

Some people choose to live close to other things, like schools or community amenities, which are not always convenient to their work locations.

Everyone who commutes MD to VA is a Moron? No, I don’t think so. Not really.

As for me: I am multi-modal in the extreme. During the school year, I drive from home (Fairfax) to my son’s School (NE DC). I park the car and get on the bike and ride back to my office (NW DC). However, as an alternative, I can take metro, along with my son, and do with some regularity. I also have a telecommute option.

During the summer, I ride from home to work most of the time, with Metro as my back up, except when I have to go up to my other work-site in Baltimore.

Let me be clear: I hate driving in and out of the city, but it is both the most economical and time efficient solution for the 2 of us, most of the time. In the mornings, I can drive from home to school in about 45-50 minutes. The longest days have still been under 60 minutes. The trip home is about 60-75 minutes, with a long of 95 minutes. Metro takes about 45 minutes from station to station for me, and about 10 minutes longer for my son, presuming no delays. However, one has to also add either a drive, walk, bike or bus from home to the station, and from the end station to the ultimate destination (insignificant for me but over a mile for my son). As for $$s — even using government’s $.55 / mile figure, the cost for the two of us to drive is $24. My actual ‘day to day’ expenditure is closer to $10 given my gas sucking car (and discounting maintenance, as many parts have to be done on somewhat the same schedule whether the car is driven or not, and cars don’t like ‘not being driven’ very much). Metro costs $23 plus $4.50 for parking, or whatever bus fare would be for each of us. Obviously biking or walking is free, but I’m not 100% ready for my son to bike on busy streets and around Vienna metro at 6:15AM, and walking takes 25 minutes or more.

For comparison, biking home to work takes about 85-90 minutes in the morning, and about 95-110 minutes in the afternoon/evening. But I love it!

Obviously, driving makes zero fiscal sense if it is just one of us, which (in addition to the fact that I hate doing it) is why I almost never drive into DC when it is just me. Add the inconvenience, such as the inability to use I-66 as a non-HOV commuter, and that makes it a non-starter. But for 2, it makes sense.

[rcannon100]

Hmmm– judgmental much?

Tongue-in-cheek? This is what emoticons are for? Tone doesnt come well in typing? :rolleyes:

Said with flare because (a) it is probably one of the major reasons we have such transportation problems at places like the CJ bridge (yes it is still called the CJ bridge by most natives). and (b) it is a HUGE problem for Arlington. Arlington because a transportation throughput for people who dont live where they work. Arlington aggressively follows smart-growth while people who live in Loudon and work downtown call for Arlington to get paved (widen 66 – to become another 395). Or, and this is cute, because MoCo refused to pave MoCo, people who live in MoCo, come across the CJ, and then inbound on either the GW or 66 – again screaming about the traffic and calling for Arlington to get paved.

Yes, what you say is right. I hear you.

But there is a huge problem with

* people following the old school philosophy of “drive till you can afford” for housing – living way out – and then cost shifting the transportation burdens on other jurisdictions. (and by the way it doesnt work – studies show that the old school “drive till you can afford” approach to housing results in substantial transportation costs and none existent savings)
* People who live on one side of the river and work on the other
* People who live on one side of the river, cross to the other side to commute, only to cross again to get to work (MoCo > GW > DC).

Part of the new urban movement is to say, stop this type of insanity. Where there are lots of unique situations, the number of people who have just made bad decisions is significant – and they are imposing the cost of their bad decisions on the rest of us.

Everyone who commutes MD to VA is a Moron? No, I don’t think so. Not really.

Nah! Just most of them

For the longest time my son played travel hockey. We live in Arlington. First year he played at Reston. Then Rockville. Then Ashburn. Then Rockville. Then, um no I cant say it (Charlottesville). Then Rockville. Yes, anyone who inflicts the CJ bridge on themselves on a regular basis is a moron (including all hockey parents). :p

[ShawnoftheDread]

@TwoWheelsDC 42887 wrote:

Anyone else notice that the rail is “light rail”? Metro is heavy rail, as are most “subway” systems. I guess it’s because this study is from Portland, which only has a light rail streetcar system AFAIK, but it would be interesting to see if there was a difference in happiness levels between heavy rail commuters and light rail commuters. If DC ever gets the streetcar running, we might eventually see some data…

My guess is that’s a distinction that would be lost on most commuters.

[consularrider]

@rcannon100 42892 wrote:

…yes it is still called the CJ bridge by most natives… :p

OK, the CJ (Cabin John), for us non-natives, is that the Chain Bridge or the American Legion Bridge? :confused:

[rcannon100]

@consularrider 42898 wrote:

OK, the CJ (Cabin John), for us non-natives, is that the Chain Bridge or the American Legion Bridge? :confused:

Yes :p

[dasgeh]

Re: jurisdiction-crossing commutes — I think it’s a huge problem created, in part, by the fragmented governance of this region. If we were all under the umbrella of one jurisdiction, there would be more coherent policies and more hope of creating a unified, logical transportation network. And, btw, all of this makes Gov. McDonnell’s no gas tax proposal even more ridiculous — if people don’t incur the added cost of their extra driving, then of course they want to live out in the biggest house they can afford. And make Arlington pay (in part) for their long commutes. Ugh.

[Steve]

@rcannon100 42892 wrote:

Arlington aggressively follows smart-growth while people who live in Loudon and work downtown call for Arlington to get paved (widen 66 – to become another 395).

Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t the Arlington’s smart growth strategy primarly centered on the Metro system that this thread was started to hate on? Isn’t most of the mixed zone, high density living along the R-B corridor, and somewhat in the Crystal City/Pentagon City area, with now parts of Lee Highway (the metro accessable areas, primarily) and Columbia Pike trying to move in that direction?

[TwoWheelsDC]

@Steve 43143 wrote:

Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t the Arlington’s smart growth strategy primarly centered on the Metro system that this thread was started to hate on? Isn’t most of the mixed zone, high density living along the R-B corridor, and somewhat in the Crystal City/Pentagon City area, with now parts of Lee Highway (the metro accessable areas, primarily) and Columbia Pike trying to move in that direction?

I think the complaints are directed against Metro the organization and not Metro the system. There’s a pretty big difference between saying “the system is run poorly, making it a pain to use” and “why do we bother having a metro system?” I feel safe saying that every one of the “haters” in this thread recognize how essential the Metro system is and how transit-oriented development is good for the region, but that doesn’t mean the system can’t be unpleasant to use much of the time due to severe mismanagement. Between fare increases, track maintenance, several high-profile accidents and breakdowns, escalator problems, some terrible customer service, and out-of-touch executives, Metro the organization is Metro the system’s worst enemy.

[Steve]

@TwoWheelsDC 43149 wrote:

I think the complaints are directed against Metro the organization and not Metro the system.

That’s a fair distinction. Though I don’t think Metro the organization is nearly as bad as people make it out to be, but still, I see what you are saying.

One thing I am always curious about is the financial details of European systems. Everyone loves the systems of Barcelona, Paris, London, everywhere in Germany, etc., but I wonder what their funding levels are compared to Metro, and if their financial losses are much greater. Some of those countries fund public use much more than we do here, so it might not be a totally fair comparison. Again, I don’t know on this one, I just am curious about whether or not this has an effect each time I ride a system in another country.

[rcannon100]

@Steve 43143 wrote:

Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t the Arlington’s smart growth strategy primarly centered on the Metro system that this thread was started to hate on? Isn’t most of the mixed zone, high density living along the R-B corridor, and somewhat in the Crystal City/Pentagon City area, with now parts of Lee Highway (the metro accessable areas, primarily) and Columbia Pike trying to move in that direction?

True. But what’s your point. Just bc Arlco’s smart growth strategy is founded in large part on WMATA, doesnt mean WMATA doesnt suck. WMATA is a far cry from what it use to be back in the day when Arlco embarked on its Smart Growth strategy.

Side note: What part of Lee Hwy is metro accessible??? Two points, but not the hwy itself (Rosslyn and EFC). Lee Hwy does not enjoy the benefits of the subways system.

Which brings us around. Lee Hwy is serviced by a bus system. When I moved in, buses ran every 12 min, and they were full. Then they ran ever 14 min. Now they sometimes have a 25 min gap between service, and the buses are sardine cans. The buses are unreliable – individual buses regularly just dont show up. And when you have that big of a gap between buses, that’s a long time to be standing. The HVAC regularly doesnt work. The signs on the bus dont work (I missed a bus two weeks ago because the driver could not get the sign to stop reading “CALL THE POLICE” and it wasnt until he pulled out of rosslyn that I figured out that the CALL THE POLICE bus was actually the Lee Hwy bus, and they werent gonna get the sign to work).

Steve, you live in Ballston right. That means WMATA = subways system for you, right.

I stand by my observation: the more likely you are to rely on the bus part of the system, the more likely WMATA is not an option (as also reflected in that study that buses suck just about as much as cars do).

[KLizotte]

To be fair, a lot of WMATA’s problems relates to funding issues (and contractor theft). The system is aging so it will break down more without adequate preventative maintenance but the jurisdictions haven’t gotten their act together to fully fund the system on-time or adequately. This all feeds into the conservative political constituency’s theory that all public systems are bad, thus less funding, and the cycle continues to spiral downwards.

My biggest complaint about WMATA are poorly behaved passengers (food, talking loudly on cell phones, people leaving trash behind).

[Steve]

@rcannon100 43162 wrote:

True. But what’s your point. Just bc Arlco’s smart growth strategy is founded in large part on WMATA, doesnt mean WMATA doesnt suck. .

Side note: What part of Lee Hwy is metro accessible??? Two points, but not the hwy itself (Rosslyn and EFC). Lee Hwy does not enjoy the benefits of the subways system.

Steve, you live in Ballston right. That means WMATA = subways system for you, right.

I stand by my observation: the more likely you are to rely on the bus part of the system, the more likely WMATA is not an option (as also reflected in that study that buses suck just about as much as cars do).

My point is if Metro (or WMATA) sucked so bad, then the smart growth around its infrastructure would not continue to thrive. But it has, and it continues to grow, because people continue to want to use it.

I guess it depends on the definition of accessible. I would say under a mile is accessable, and a healthy part of Lee Hwy is within that distance from Rosslyn, Courthouse, and Clarendon. Some may argue that more like .75 miles is accessible, which is probably a fair argument, but still, a decent part of Lee highway can get to those stops within that distance.

Yes I live in Ballston. I’ve also lived in Clarendon and Crystal City. In CC I used to take the bus a fair amount for grocery shopping, because that was my best option. I’ve never argued that the bus system was great, but I think a lot of it is due to traffic in the area, and the fact that we don’t provide the right bus infrastructure (dedicated lanes). That part is not WMATAs fault. Folks that use the more specialized bus services (ART, Circulator, etc) actually tend to say very good things about it.

Also, you started this thread with a post about MetroRail service, not MetroBus. So I think commenting on what makes MetroRail service good is fair of me.

[Author]

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