I-66 HOT lanes proposed, with multimodal improvements

[sjclaeys]

@chris_s 106411 wrote:

But is it really a further restriction? How many folks are in a 2 person carpool who can’t get to a 3 person carpool with a little extra work + now people who were completely forbidden from using I-66 (because they can’t get a carpool) CAN use I-66, if they pay. Hard to say if it’ll be a net increase or net decrease in people using 66; and it may push some folks to transit or biking or who knows?

One can hope for that outcome, though I do not see people commuting in from Loudoun and points west using transit or biking. As far as people’s willingness to pay, it would be good to see how the new Rt-95 HOT are used over a good sample of time.

[lordofthemark]

@sjclaeys 106419 wrote:

One can hope for that outcome, though I do not see people commuting in from Loudoun and points west using transit or biking. As far as people’s willingness to pay, it would be good to see how the new Rt-95 HOT are used over a good sample of time.

There is already express bus service from Loudoun to Tysons, the Pentagon, and DC, IIUC.

I495 HOT lane usage has ramped up more slowly than Transurban hoped, but faster than many feared. Not sure how it has gone on I95.

[scoot]

@dplasters 106377 wrote:

You still have to deal with traffic merging on/off from a combination of Gallows, Fairview Park and 495 though. I can’t imagine the intersection with Gallows ever being changed to a typical intersection and I can’t imagine they would ever cut off the ramp access that fairviewpark / 50 have to 495. My imagination is a 1.5 mile long sky bridge solution.
[ATTACH=CONFIG]7651[/ATTACH]

Yes please on the 1.5mi skybridge! Otherwise you’re probably looking at, what, 12 crosswalks through highway on- and off-ramps? Many of which would likely have poor visibility. Implementation is the real concern here, not ROW.

[scoot]

@chris_s 106411 wrote:

But is it really a further restriction? How many folks are in a 2 person carpool who can’t get to a 3 person carpool with a little extra work + now people who were completely forbidden from using I-66 (because they can’t get a carpool) CAN use I-66, if they pay. Hard to say if it’ll be a net increase or net decrease in people using 66; and it may push some folks to transit or biking or who knows?

Plus there is the phenomenon of induced demand, which works in reverse too. If Wash Blvd / Lee Hwy / etc. are already bad, people displaced from 66 might stop driving or change their hours.

[mstone]

@dplasters 106377 wrote:

You still have to deal with traffic merging on/off from a combination of Gallows, Fairview Park and 495 though. I can’t imagine the intersection with Gallows ever being changed to a typical intersection and I can’t imagine they would ever cut off the ramp access that fairviewpark / 50 have to 495. My imagination is a 1.5 mile long sky bridge solution.

Getting rid of that ridiculous mess is part of turning 50 back from being an interstate highway. I drive there regularly–it sucks for driving, also. There just isn’t a good reason for all of those ramps. It won’t happen because cars, but it’s what should happen.

[baiskeli]

@sjclaeys 106404 wrote:

I know that I will be scorned by the self-righteous for this, but I worry that further restricting 66 will increase commuters going through Arlington to use Washington Blvd, Lee Highway and neighborhood streets for their commute. It is already bad as it is.

The addition of HOT might mitigate that by allowing those who are willing to pay a toll to use 66 without carpooling. Plus some of those people will be carpoolers in HOV-3 cars instead, reducing total traffic. If it works out. In any event, if 66 is clogged to the max people are going to take the side roads anyway.

[scoot]

@mstone 106433 wrote:

Getting rid of that ridiculous mess is part of turning 50 back from being an interstate highway. I drive there regularly–it sucks for driving, also.

You can drive directly through there on Route 50 without having to stop at all. Other movements are facilitated by ramps. I’d say it’s great for drivers actually. Isn’t that the point?

Maybe tough if you don’t know where you’re going.

[scoot]

OTOH, one thing that does suck for drivers is the unnecessary addition of an extra lane for just that stretch. Which means that everyone has to merge back together anyway, causing delays. But that has nothing to do with the number of ramps.

[mstone]

@scoot 106441 wrote:

You can drive directly through there on Route 50 without having to stop at all. Other movements are facilitated by ramps. I’d say it’s great for drivers actually. Isn’t that the point?

Maybe tough if you don’t know where you’re going.

Actually being on those ramps is a PITA, and incredibly confusing if you don’t know where you’re going (and annoying if stuck behind someone who doesn’t know where they’re going). It’s a lot of twisty pavement, and the maintenance budget apparently doesn’t cover it. There are a lot of high speed merges due to the ramps, which are generally a dangerous feature. Add to all that the fact that there are stop lights fairly close in either direction, and there’s no real advantage in speeding up for that brief stretch–every day it’s backed up just about to the beltway from the stoplights on either end. It’s like someone had a deranged vision of turning 50 into 66 but only had the budget for a mile or so.

The fact that it’s actively hostile to bikes & peds is just the icing on the cake.

[scoot]

I admit that my experience driving through that area is maybe once a month. I’m usually either going straight through on Route 50, or else 50 to/from the Beltway. And never during rush hour. It’s not a pleasant drive by any means, but that section is certainly optimized for vehicular thru traffic, until you reach the traffic signals and lane reductions at either end.

Yes, the merges and traffic signals at either end do cause delays, even off hours. But it would be much slower for through traffic if those ramps were replaced by at-grade intersections, since the red phase would be very long, especially at Gallows.

As for a ped/bike solution, I just hope they can keep the number of at-grade ramp crossings to a minimum.

[PotomacCyclist]

http://wtop.com/sprawl-crawl/2015/01/public-meetings-66-held-week/

Meeting dates plus “snow dates”:

Monday, Jan. 26, 2015, 6 – 8:30 p.m.

Oakton High School – Cafeteria (Entrance #1 or #14)

2900 Sutton Road, Vienna, VA 22181

Snow Date: Thursday, Feb. 5, 2015, 6 – 8:30 p.m.

VDOT Northern Virginia District, first floor, Occoquan Room

4975 Alliance Drive, Fairfax, VA 22030

Tuesday, Jan. 27, 2015, 6 – 8:30 p.m.

Bull Run Elementary School – Cafeteria (Entrance #1)

15301 Lee Highway, Centreville, VA 20121

Snow Date: Thursday, Feb. 5, 2015, 6 – 8:30 p.m.

VDOT Northern Virginia District, first floor, Occoquan Room

4975 Alliance Drive, Fairfax, VA 22030

Wednesday, Jan. 28, 2015, 6 – 8:30 p.m.

Battlefield High School – Cafeteria (Entrance #1 or #4)

15000 Graduation Drive, Haymarket, VA 20169

Snow Date: Wednesday, Feb. 4, 2015, 6 – 8:30 p.m.

Battlefield High School – Cafeteria (Entrance #1 or #4)

15000 Graduation Drive, Haymarket, VA 20169

Thursday, Jan. 29, 2015, 6 – 8:30 p.m.

VDOT Northern Virginia District, first floor, Occoquan Room

4975 Alliance Drive, Fairfax, VA 22030

Snow Date: Thursday, Feb. 5, 2015,6 – 8:30 p.m.

VDOT Northern Virginia District, first floor, Occoquan Room

4975 Alliance Drive, Fairfax, VA 22030

[chris_s]

Think VDOT should widen the Custis when they make I-66 into HOT lanes? Think they should prioritize building the Arlington Blvd Trail as an alternative? Think they should help Arlington fix the Intersection of Doom while they’re at it? Perhaps you think they should commit to funding 8-car trains on the Orange Line before they even think about widening 66?

Come tell them yourself! VDOT will be attending the Arlington County Transportation Commission meeting on Thursday February 5th at 7:30pm to brief the commission on these multimodal improvements they are proposing for the I-66 corridor. They’re even the first item on the agenda so you don’t have to sit through anything other than their presentation before speaking.

The meeting is in the County Board Room on the 3rd floor of the County building at 2100 Clarendon Blvd.

[mstone]

Went to the meeting tonight, usual level of VDOT coordination. One person talking about how there are 9 lanes of demand, and there is no way to eliminate congestion by building, then another guy says there’s no need to worry about the street grid because they can just draw more people onto the highway.

If we get a trail it’ll be over VDOT’s dead body. They do plan to add a path over 66 at 50, to connect to something else at an unspecified future date.

[scoot]

@mstone 107002 wrote:

VDOT’s dead body

Why does this phrase make me break out into an enormous grin?

[chris_s]

@chris_s 106875 wrote:

Think VDOT should widen the Custis when they make I-66 into HOT lanes? Think they should prioritize building the Arlington Blvd Trail as an alternative? Think they should help Arlington fix the Intersection of Doom while they’re at it? Perhaps you think they should commit to funding 8-car trains on the Orange Line before they even think about widening 66?

Come tell them yourself! VDOT will be attending the Arlington County Transportation Commission meeting on Thursday February 5th at 7:30pm to brief the commission on these multimodal improvements they are proposing for the I-66 corridor. They’re even the first item on the agenda so you don’t have to sit through anything other than their presentation before speaking.

The meeting is in the County Board Room on the 3rd floor of the County building at 2100 Clarendon Blvd.

Reminder: this is tonight!

[Author]

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