HAWK signal on GW Parkway on 11/18?

[dbb]

Photos from this morning. NPS worker on site before 0700. Looks like the flashing light will be high enough to alert motorists several cars back.

[dasgeh]

So only one? Isn’t one of the main problems here due to cars coming in the second lane?

[oldbikechick]

@dasgeh 70877 wrote:

So only one? Isn’t one of the main problems here due to cars coming in the second lane?

Riding past tonight it looked like it was on both sides. And VERY visible!

[dbb]

Warning – My assessment and assumptions are below. Possibility (slight) I could be totally incorrect.

Given the infrastructure and the lack of a easy way to get wiring under the GW Memorial Parkway (particularly for a temporary installation), the lights only on the side of departure would be activated by the cyclist or ped. The light on the pole would need to be tall enough for motorists approaching the crosswalk (several cars back) to see the flashing light from both lanes.

As these lights are demonstrated and found wonderfully effective (my hope) the NPS can look at strategies for a more permanent installation.

[oldbikechick]

@dbb 70971 wrote:

Warning – My assessment and assumptions are below. Possibility (slight) I could be totally incorrect.

Given the infrastructure and the lack of a easy way to get wiring under the GW Memorial Parkway (particularly for a temporary installation), the lights only on the side of departure would be activated by the cyclist or ped. The light on the pole would need to be tall enough for motorists approaching the crosswalk (several cars back) to see the flashing light from both lanes.

As these lights are demonstrated and found wonderfully effective (my hope) the NPS can look at strategies for a more permanent installation.

A jogger was crossing as I passed by and both lights were flashing. They seemed visible from pretty far back.

[dbb]

You can submit your comments at this site

http://parkplanning.nps.gov/document.cfm?documentID=56190

Operators are standing by!

[DaveK]

@dbb 70971 wrote:

Warning – My assessment and assumptions are below. Possibility (slight) I could be totally incorrect.

Given the infrastructure and the lack of a easy way to get wiring under the GW Memorial Parkway (particularly for a temporary installation), the lights only on the side of departure would be activated by the cyclist or ped. The light on the pole would need to be tall enough for motorists approaching the crosswalk (several cars back) to see the flashing light from both lanes.

As these lights are demonstrated and found wonderfully effective (my hope) the NPS can look at strategies for a more permanent installation.

These can be permanent – the device they installed is called an RRFB (rectangular rapid-flash beacon). Almost all the brands on the market are wireless and don’t require trenching. They connect with their paired device wirelessly, so all you need to do is mount the poles.

[dbb]

Passing on a request from the NPS.

The lights do not automatically trigger so trail users need to push the button. As you do, please observe the traffic behavior for a couple of reasons – so you can provide your observations during the public comment period and to ensure it is safe for you to cross. This is a training process for the motorists and we start the lessons when activate the lights. Please push the button!

[TwoWheelsDC]

@dbb 71052 wrote:

Passing on a request from the NPS.

This is a training process for the motorists and we start the lessons when activate the lights. Please push the button!

Increased law enforcement would go a long way in this “training” process…

[KLizotte]

So I’m a little confused. Are the lights supposed to get cars to stop or simply slow down? I think this sends a totally confusing msg to drivers and cyclists. There is a crosswalk which usually denotes a requirement to stop but yellow lights mean “use caution” but then again, we are talking about a highway (where a crosswalk really doesn’t belong). I’m generally in favor of cars not stopping because of the two lanes and past history with cars rear ending each other.

[dasgeh]

@KLizotte 71055 wrote:

So I’m a little confused. Are the lights supposed to get cars to stop or simply slow down? I think this sends a totally confusing msg to drivers and cyclists. There is a crosswalk which usually denotes a requirement to stop but yellow lights mean “use caution” but then again, we are talking about a highway off ramp here (where a crosswalk really doesn’t belong to begin with). I’m generally in favor of cars not stopping because of the two lanes and past history with cars rear ending each other.

I agree, though I don’t believe this is the highway off-ramp crossing. This is the at-grade parkway crossing, which is down the hill.

[KLizotte]

@dasgeh 71059 wrote:

I agree, though I don’t believe this is the highway off-ramp crossing. This is the at-grade parkway crossing, which is down the hill.

You’re right. I stand corrected.

[DaveK]

Any beacon including this one is designed to call attention to the sign with which it’s mounted. For example you might have seen, out in rural areas, amber flashing beacons above and below a “signal ahead” warning sign alerting you that there’s a signal when there may not have been one for many miles previously. This one is designed to call attention to the crosswalk warnings. Usually if the beacon is actuated by a button (which this one is) there will be a placard mounted by the button with instructions. It usually goes something like “Press button, wait for vehicles to stop, then cross”. This beacon doesn’t change the legal rights and responsibilities of crosswalk users and drivers, which have been endlessly debated and please dear lord let’s not start that again. It’s only able to increase yielding behavior by providing an additional cue that there are crosswalk users present. In practice, studies show that this device does in fact increase motorist yielding behavior to pedestrians by over 80%. It went well for me last night when I went through there.

[mstone]

@TwoWheelsDC 71054 wrote:

Increased law enforcement would go a long way in this “training” process…

Enforcement of what? They chose to install a signal which does not require the motorists to stop…

[KLizotte]

@mstone 71081 wrote:

Enforcement of what? They chose to install a signal which does not require the motorists to stop…

That is where the confusion lies. It’s been known for a while that NPS occasionally tickets drivers for stopping at the crosswalk (presumably because it’s a highway). And at the same time, there have been fatal accidents when drivers do stop. The same can be said when drivers do not stop.

Let’s face it. It’s a piece of roadway that should not have a crosswalk to begin with, rather a bridge or tunnel, so it is unclear from a safety and legal standpoint whether drivers should be encouraged to stop at all even though there is a crosswalk. Slow down, definitely.

At the end of the day, I want to know whether I should tell NPS they are working if cars slow down and/or stop.

[Author]

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