Gravel Grinder

[TwoWheelsDC]

Oh, that looks like a great ride, so I’m glad you asked!

Anyway, so a “gravel grinder” is just a ride that’s primarily on gravel roads or where you go out of your way to ride gravel roads. Gravel bikes are bikes designed to ride longer distances on gravel…I think it’s more of a marketing term than anything, but “gravel bikes” tend to have geometry that’s closer to a touring bike and room for fairly wide tires, like 32-45 range. Based on my exposure to them, gravel bikes, unlike touring bikes, tend to be setup more like road bikes in the sense that they are lighter and not generally outfitted with racks and all that kind of stuff (with exceptions, of course).

I haven’t been able to thoroughly examine the Parvilla route, but I think the suitability of your bike would be highly dependent on the conditions. Relatively slick 28s or 32s can do fine on dry, hard-packed gravel so long as it’s not too coarse. IIRC, the roads around Waterford, for example, are not particularly gravel-y and generally would be okay on a regular road bike if it’s not wet. That’s not to say that you can’t ride gravel on 25s or whatever, it just gets trickier and potentially frustrating rather than fun.

Regarding tires, I think you can get the Clement X’Plors in a 32. Also, I think the Panaracer Gravel Kings come in 28s. You could use CX tires as well, which are easy enough to find in 28s, although they may have more aggressive tread (slower on pavement) than you need for gravel.

[lossomes]

@TwoWheelsDC 165026 wrote:

Oh, that looks like a great ride, so I’m glad you asked!

Anyway, so a “gravel grinder” is just a ride that’s primarily on gravel roads or where you go out of your way to ride gravel roads. Gravel bikes are bikes designed to ride longer distances on gravel…I think it’s more of a marketing term than anything, but “gravel bikes” tend to have geometry that’s closer to a touring bike and room for fairly wide tires, like 32-45 range. Based on my exposure to them, gravel bikes, unlike touring bikes, tend to be setup more like road bikes in the sense that they are lighter and not generally outfitted with racks and all that kind of stuff (with exceptions, of course).

I haven’t been able to thoroughly examine the Parvilla route, but I think the suitability of your bike would be highly dependent on the conditions. Relatively slick 28s or 32s can do fine on dry, hard-packed gravel so long as it’s not too coarse. IIRC, the roads around Waterford, for example, are not particularly gravel-y and generally would be okay on a regular road bike if it’s not wet. That’s not to say that you can’t ride gravel on 25s or whatever, it just gets trickier and potentially frustrating rather than fun.

Regarding tires, I think you can get the Clement X’Plors in a 32. Also, I think the Panaracer Gravel Kings come in 28s. You could use CX tires as well, which are easy enough to find in 28s, although they may have more aggressive tread (slower on pavement) than you need for gravel.

This is super helpful – thank you! I’ve reached out to Parvilla and hope to hear more about the conditions and what to expect.

[Sunyata]

If you can get a copy of the route, I can give you specifics about gravel conditions on the roads you will be traversing. Over the past 8 months, I have done “a few” rides out there…

[hozn]

I have ridden Pete’s Round Hill gravel route on 28mm slicks and it was just fine. This summer I rode a fair bit of gravel of varying degree of chunkiness on 30mm G-One Speed tires which were fantastic (and maybe what I’d recommend). I wouldn’t hesitate to use a Domane Disc with 28-32mm tires for anything labeled “gravel” around here, though I would also pack 2+ tubes for any gravel event. Then you won’t need them! (While I wouldn’t hesitate to ride on narrower tires, I might also choose wider tires on rough gravel for comfort or just increased confidence/negligence on corners.)

[lossomes]

@Sunyata 165037 wrote:

If you can get a copy of the route, I can give you specifics about gravel conditions on the roads you will be traversing. Over the past 8 months, I have done “a few” rides out there…

Thank you so much!
40 Mile
http://www.mapmyride.com/routes/view/1745590622

65 Mile
http://www.mapmyride.com/routes/view/1745558423

[lossomes]

@hozn 165043 wrote:

I have ridden Pete’s Round Hill gravel route on 28mm slicks and it was just fine. This summer I rode a fair bit of gravel of varying degree of chunkiness on 30mm G-One Speed tires which were fantastic (and maybe what I’d recommend). I wouldn’t hesitate to use a Domane Disc with 28-32mm tires for anything labeled “gravel” around here, though I would also pack 2+ tubes for any gravel event. Then you won’t need them! (While I wouldn’t hesitate to ride on narrower tires, I might also choose wider tires on rough gravel for comfort or just increased confidence/negligence on corners.)

I don’t recall the last time I left my house without a minimum of 2 extra tubes

I always run my tires at max PSI (whatever the tire says on the sidewall). Would this be the right approach to a gravel ride? I think it’s relevant, but I’m 6’6 250lb

[hozn]

For gravel (especially) you get better traction from lowering your pressure. But you risk pinch flatting I’d you aren’t running tubeless. So there’s some happy medium somewhere. I run my 30mm tires at around 50-60psi, but I weigh ~180lbs, so obviously this is quite individual.

[Sunyata]

@lossomes 165044 wrote:

Thank you so much!
40 Mile
http://www.mapmyride.com/routes/view/1745590622

65 Mile
http://www.mapmyride.com/routes/view/1745558423

It looks like these routes are staying on fairly groomed gravel. From a “can you do it and not die” standpoint, I think 28’s would be fine. But from a “is it comfortable” standpoint, I would want wider tires that I could run lower pressure. This is mostly because there is a lot of washboard and holes out there now due to the rains we have had over the past few weeks. So, if you can fit 32’s, I would go that route. But if not, 28’s would not be unreasonable, especially if you can get a little bit of tread on them.

[lossomes]

@Sunyata 165059 wrote:

It looks like these routes are staying on fairly groomed gravel. From a “can you do it and not die” standpoint, I think 28’s would be fine. But from a “is it comfortable” standpoint, I would want wider tires that I could run lower pressure. This is mostly because there is a lot of washboard and holes out there now due to the rains we have had over the past few weeks. So, if you can fit 32’s, I would go that route. But if not, 28’s would not be unreasonable, especially if you can get a little bit of tread on them.

Awesome. Will swing by my LBS this weekend to figure out what fits. Thanks!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[hozn]

@lossomes 165060 wrote:

Awesome. Will swing by my LBS this weekend to figure out what fits. Thanks!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If your LBS carries Specialized you might consider the Specialized Roubaix 2BR Pro in a 30/32 size; you can run that tubeless. Maybe that’s a bit more than you want to do for this ride, but you’ll probably never go back to tubes once you do it. Your shop can tape your current rims for you, so this isn’t a huge investment. But it definitely is more involved overall than just sticking with tubes (but [mostly] gone are the days of pinch flats and having a tire that seals small punctures automatically is worth the extra setup hassle, in my opinion). I’m down to around 1 flat a year now for past couple years [where I actually have to take off the tire and put in a tube] and that’s with a lot of off-road riding thrown in the mix too. I think actually in past 12 months I’ve gotten zero flats — I’m sure I’ll double flat tonight.

Bontrager also makes a nice slick 32mm tire (R3? R4?), though I’m not sure if it’s tubeless-ready. When I rented a Trek Domane SLR Disc, though, it was those 32mm tires that were on there. I don’t remember it being super tight, but the internet forums suggest a 32c tire is probably as big as you can go.

[lossomes]

@hozn 165067 wrote:

If your LBS carries Specialized you might consider the Specialized Roubaix 2BR Pro in a 30/32 size; you can run that tubeless. Maybe that’s a bit more than you want to do for this ride, but you’ll probably never go back to tubes once you do it. Your shop can tape your current rims for you, so this isn’t a huge investment. But it definitely is more involved overall than just sticking with tubes (but [mostly] gone are the days of pinch flats and having a tire that seals small punctures automatically is worth the extra setup hassle, in my opinion). I’m down to around 1 flat a year now for past couple years [where I actually have to take off the tire and put in a tube] and that’s with a lot of off-road riding thrown in the mix too. I think actually in past 12 months I’ve gotten zero flats — I’m sure I’ll double flat tonight.

Bontrager also makes a nice slick 32mm tire (R3? R4?), though I’m not sure if it’s tubeless-ready. When I rented a Trek Domane SLR Disc, though, it was those 32mm tires that were on there. I don’t remember it being super tight, but the internet forums suggest a 32c tire is probably as big as you can go.

I’ve long been curious about tubeless, but my ignorance has really held me back. Maybe you can help me with a couple of questions?

(1) in the event you do get a flat while tubeless, are you totally screwed? Are you able to un-glue the tire and put in a tube when you’re out in the middle of a ride? Or would the ride just be over?

(2) let’s say i do go with the Specialized Roubaix 2BR Pro 32 tubeless – what kind of difference can i expect when doing regular ol road riding? Would those same tubeless 32 tires still be appropriate for a mountainous road ride (ie: Garrett County Gran Fondo)? What about on a long flat ride, like Bike to the Beach or Seagull Century?

[hozn]

@lossomes 165069 wrote:

I’ve long been curious about tubeless, but my ignorance has really held me back. Maybe you can help me with a couple of questions?

(1) in the event you do get a flat while tubeless, are you totally screwed? Are you able to un-glue the tire and put in a tube when you’re out in the middle of a ride? Or would the ride just be over?

So, there’s an important distinction here between “tubeless” and “tubular”. Tubular is old technology that is still (often) used by professionals … because they have a team car driving behind them to just give them a new bike if they get a flat tire. Yeah, flatting on tubulars, by all accounts, sucks. Some people still use tubulars today. If they use them on the road, they tend to (if smart) carry a spare, pre-glued tire and then they get to wrestle one off on the road if they flat. They say that the ride is sublime. I suspect that one couldn’t tell the difference on a blind test between a tubular and tubeless — or probably even a clincher with a latex tube — but I’ve never ridden tubular. I also don’t use a shaving brush and straight razor when I shave, so I suspect I’m not the target market for tubular. Tubulars are also possible with ‘cross because in a ‘cross race you are only ever 100 feet from your car and because the idea is that you can run lower pressures than you could [without burping air around corners] with tubeless. I’m sure there’s something to that, but basically nothing that applies to cyclocross racing applies to real-world cycling — unless you also find yourself getting physically sick with worry over whether you should be running 28.25psi or 28.47psi on weekend ride.

In the other corner, in the land of sanity and practicality, there is tubeless.

Tubeless is just a clincher tire (a *special* clincher tire — don’t try to convert any old road tire) that doesn’t need an inner tube. Typically (advisably) you add 1-2oz of latex sealant (e.g. Stans sealant or Orange Seal) in the tire, which seals any microscopic holes in tire (or tiny gaps between valve stem and rim bed) and is also what helps seal punctures you get while riding.

If you get a flat [that just doesn’t self-heal] while riding tubeless, you just take the tire off like normal and install an inner tube. Then you basically have a regular tubed tire. Of course, you had sealant in there, so it’s a bit messier than a normal tube change. On the other hand, you don’t have to hunt for the thing that caused the puncture in the tire, since you’ve got sealant spraying out of the hole in the tire. (And if it was small enough for it to be hard to find the offending object, then it would have sealed without you having to put in a tube.)

The downsides to tubeless are:
– The tires can be harder to mount (tighter) due to the non-stretching bead. It depends a lot on the tires, but I haven’t noticed this to be categorically true.
– The tires can be more expensive. (But the Spec Roubaix 2BR is not an expensive tire. And the excellent Schwalbe Pro One tires are available for ~$45 from Merlin Cycles)
– Getting them to seat initially can be tricky with a standard floor pump. I have a Lezyne Dirt Drive that pushes a lot of air, which does the trick for me. Some people use compressors. On some rims [probably those designed for tubeless] this is less of an issue.
– They don’t hold air long-term as well as butyl tubes. Expect to add a few pumps every few days. Not as bad as latex tubes, but it’s something to note.

The upsides are many, though, and -at least to me- are well worth these downsides.

@lossomes 165069 wrote:

(2) let’s say i do go with the Specialized Roubaix 2BR Pro 32 tubeless – what kind of difference can i expect when doing regular ol road riding? Would those same tubeless 32 tires still be appropriate for a mountainous road ride (ie: Garrett County Gran Fondo)? What about on a long flat ride, like Bike to the Beach or Seagull Century?

Yeah, those would be good on Garrett County Gran Fondo; they’re pretty nice all-surface tires. Personally, I ran [tubeless] 25mm Schwalbe Pro One tires for GCGF, including the gravel bit. So for a ride like that I might prefer racier tires, but nothing to stop you from using the Roubaix tires for road. They aren’t going to roll quite as fast as a racier tire (like a Pro One), but they’ll be a lot faster than a cyclocross tire. My feeling is that those Specialized tires roll about the same as the Bontrager 32mm tires — and about the same as a Schwalbe G-One Speed 30mm. These are all tires that are targeting conditions like Paris Roubaix (hence name) — so think mixture of dirt, cobbles, pavement.

Hope that helps.

[lossomes]

@hozn 165072 wrote:

I also don’t use a shaving brush and straight razor when I shave, so I suspect I’m not the target market for tubular.

lol

Thanks again for all the advice. I feel much more confident heading to the LBS to discuss this further!

[Author]

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