Ebike commute from Reston to DC

[dasgeh]

@Tim Kelley 148412 wrote:

I wondered what other countries do in terms of regulating e-bikes.

There’s a federal law in the U.S. that specifies which ebikes get exemptions from registration and car-like requirements for things like lights.

[lordofthemark]

@americancyclo 148438 wrote:

If you remove the “e-” prefix and change the location, you sounds like the drivers

We don’t do this on the roads, so why on the MUPs? A Chevy Suburban at 5500 lbs has no more legal responsibility than a Mazda 2 at 2500 lbs.

We do have a few roads where trucks are excluded, and a few highways where trucks are excluded from certain lanes. Not many, but a few.

Also cyclists are not intrinsically capable of faster speeds on say, M Street than other road users. If they pass, it is because they are able to filter. Which introduces a host of other issues. In general motorists do not call passes, or have I been missing something?

[dasgeh]

@hozn 148417 wrote:

For my own part, I have never actually encountered an e-bike that is just riding at the speed of traffic.

I imagine this is observation bias — you probably have, but haven’t looked close enough at the bike to see if it’s an ebike (and admit it, you are usually going faster than most traffic, so you’d have to pause and look). And I don’t that’s true, because I think you’ve passed me. I get passed by about half the number of people I pass. I consider that “the speed of traffic”

@hozn 148417 wrote:

only that learning to go fast means also learning how to react quickly, brake quickly, etc.

So people that are already strong should not be allowed to ride fast when they start riding? You may want to talk to triathletes who come from running/swimming…

@hozn 148417 wrote:

I think we all agree that increased weight and speed present a bigger risk of injury to all involved.

As has been pointed out, the motor and battery add about 30lbs to a bike. Even if you assume someone would ride a lighter bike if it weren’t an ebike, the difference between ebike and bike they would ride is probably 50lbs. The majority of weight is still the rider. Should we regulate people based on their weight? Lower speed limits if you’re a larger person?

Small person + regular bike = ~ 160 lbs. small person + ebike = ~ 210lbs.
Medium person + regular bike = ~ 200 lbs. Medium person + ebike = ~ 250lbs.
larger person + regular bike = ~ 250 lbs. larger person + ebike = ~ 300lbs.

[Judd]

@dasgeh 148443 wrote:

Which makes the complaint kinda sound like you have a problem with a woman riding that fast, and not a man.
.

Unless I’m missing some background in your relationship, it is totally inappropriate for you to imply sexism when someone points out that you are taking QOMs away from women who are achieving them without electronic assistance. At least two of my female biking friends get pretty riled up when they lose a QOM and go out and pedal their ass off to try to win it back as soon as possible.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[dasgeh]

@Judd 148448 wrote:

Unless I’m missing some background in your relationship, it is totally inappropriate for you to imply sexism when someone points out that you are taking QOMs away from women who are achieving them without electronic assistance. At least two of my female biking friends get pretty riled up when they lose a QOM and go out and pedal their ass off to try to win it back as soon as possible.

The original QOM point was not that I’m improperly using Strava (and yes, I would be completely happy to mark rides as ebike rides if they would fix their @&#$*(Q&( Android app, but I don’t respect the whole competition aspect of it enough to spend the time to update all of my rides after the fact).

The original QOM point was to say that I’m riding fast. My point is that I get passed by plenty of people (men and women, not everyone is on Strava!), and using just the QOM data to say that I’m the fastest ignores the men and makes it seem like there’s an issue being the fastest woman.

[Tim Kelley]

@dasgeh 148443 wrote:

I can’t on my phone.

Sure you can:

[ATTACH=CONFIG]12681[/ATTACH]

@dasgeh 148443 wrote:

Oh, and I haven’t had my motor on full for the last month or so. I think I’ve been faster because (drum-roll please) I’ve gotten stronger.

That still doesn’t excuse QOMs acquired previously on a an e-bike. And it’s not MY complaint about you riding fast–I’ve heard it from the larger women’s community.

My point was that a motor helps as from 12mph to 20mph as well too. Probably more, actually since wind resistance is on a exponential curve….

[lordofthemark]

@dasgeh 148447 wrote:

So people that are already strong should not be allowed to ride fast when they start riding? You may want to talk to triathletes who come from running/swimming…

Again, are talking individual cases, or policy? I expect the number of triathletes on the trails (esp triathletes new to bike riding) is small, and always will be. If Ebikes fall in price and their adoption becomes widespread, the number of ebike riders becomes considerable.

Maybe Ive become too persuaded by the VC case (as alluded to above) I tend to think of seg infra in general as something we do to get folks “from 8 to 80” riding. Slow folks, people on crap bikes, people who WILL NOT ride in traffic.

And then I am envisioning a future where Ebikes are relatively cheap.

That future, I would suggest, should be one far less reliant on seg infra. It should be one where a much wider range of folks can ride VC style. And where more people are riding in general, for all the reasons people have outlined above (showers at work, weather, distance, etc all become lesser obstacles to biking for transportation). So we can have so many bikes on the roads, that bikes are much more visible, education and enforcement are much more bike friendly, etc. The VC dream fulfilled (take it even further imagine a world of widespread ebike adoption combined with widespread autonomous vehicle adoption).

Note, I say that as a very strong advocate for seg infra, in general.

Now trails are different, I accept that. People who could easily ride on a 35MPH road are going to take trails, because trails are nice. Woods. Less exhaust.

But is that reason enough to put LOTS of relatively fast, relatively heavy (again as a population average, not talking about individuals) on the trails? Which, I would note, are already scary enough that some pedestrians are deterred from using them (we know at least one person who has sworn off walking on the MVT)

[Tim Kelley]

@dasgeh 148450 wrote:

The original QOM point was not that I’m improperly using Strava (and yes, I would be completely happy to mark rides as ebike rides if they would fix their @&#$*(Q&( Android app, but I don’t respect the whole competition aspect of it enough to spend the time to update all of my rides after the fact).

The original QOM point was to say that I’m riding fast. My point is that I get passed by plenty of people (men and women, not everyone is on Strava!), and using just the QOM data to say that I’m the fastest ignores the men and makes it seem like there’s an issue being the fastest woman.

E-bike is an option in the Android app.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]12681[/ATTACH]

The original QOM point was that the motor helps from 12-20mph, as demonstrated by your Strava data.

[Steve O]

@dasgeh 148443 wrote:

I can’t on my phone.

But you can on a computer.
@dasgeh 148443 wrote:

Oh, and I haven’t had my motor on full for the last month or so. I think I’ve been faster because (drum-roll please) I’ve gotten stronger.

Even so, 20+ QOMs dating back to 2014 seems a little suspicious. Including some on the Boda.

[Tim Kelley]

@dasgeh 148443 wrote:

BTW, last time I checked, none of my QOMs would be high on the boys’ (KOM) list.

The first one on your list? From like two weeks ago?

https://www.strava.com/segments/10185260

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[jabberwocky]

E-bikers taking Strava KOMs/QOMs = LOL. I encourage the hell out of this practice.

[LeprosyStudyGroup]

@jabberwocky 148459 wrote:

E-bikers taking Strava KOMs/QOMs = LOL. I encourage the hell out of this practice.

Every time this happens an Elf gets his solarbikecar

[dkel]

@Tim Kelley 148458 wrote:

[ATTACH=CONFIG]12682[/ATTACH]

I don’t usually LOL over forum posts. This time I LOLed.

[Judd]

@Tim Kelley 148458 wrote:

The first one on your list? From like two weeks ago?

https://www.strava.com/segments/10185260

[ATTACH=CONFIG]12682[/ATTACH]

Your use of data is totally sexist, Tim. Delete your account.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[EasyRider]

Hi cyclo, I didn’t use the words “legal responsibility,” I was speaking of “responsibility” in the plain sense — conscientousness, courtesy, etc. The things that make a “good” (e-)cyclist.

As for the comparison with roads, laws and regulations do exist in recognition that the consequences of inattentive use are greater for larger vehicles. Large trucks, trailers, and their tires are subject to excise taxes in recognition of their vehicles added wear and tear on roadways; these same trucks themeslves are often subject to weight and lane restrictions as well as lower speed limits that don’t apply to smaller passenger vehicles. Their operators require additional testing and licensing. If that 5500lb Chevy Suburban is hauling a boat, it’s subject to more regulation than the Mazda 2.

Not that I’ve called for any regulations on e-bikes in this thread. I’m just making the case that with more power, speed, weight, and effortless use — comes more personal responsibility. Just testing the waters to see who else thinks so.

As others have stated, today’s e-bikes aren’t really the problem, and the problem cases we’ve experienced are just anecdotal. The problem is a few years down the path … when they don’t cost $3,000 and every fourth or fifth bike on the path is a an e-bike capable of 20mph+. E-bikes are moving pretty quickly from being mostly cargo and kid movers to what the bike industry knows best: racy stuff marketed to 25 year old dudes. An e-bike is at the top of the food chain on a MUP and that’s a big part of it’s appeal.

[Author]

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