E-Bikes on the trails

[Lt. Dan]

@hozn 121725 wrote:

Oh, I’m pretty sure it has an [electric] motor, yes. I don’t know how fast it goes. On the sparse W&OD out here it doesn’t seem especially hazardous, but the prospect of that passing cyclists or joggers into potentially oncoming traffic could be terrifying.

Edit: here’s the details http://organictransit.com/information-about-the-elf/

So it’s an electric trike, since the motor will work in unassisted mode…..

[wheelswings]

@rcannon100 121720 wrote:

I am the slowest person out there. Everyone passes me. Always. If I pass someone, I usually stop and ask if they need help. Pregnant women riding cheater bikes up the Custis hill using electronic inhalers is not a threat to my fragile ego.

A hole six foot deep in the ground, that’s a threat to my fragile ego. On the whole, I would rather avoid descending that six feet.

Since I ride a 30 lb dinosaur — for many years with a double Burley trailer hitched behind — I’d be an idiot to try and compete with anyone, let alone rcannon or an e-bike. I’m just grateful for the reliable transportation and the joyful feeling of riding my bike.

But I think this and other Forum threads bring out some of the schizophrenic strands in the bicycling world. In some ways I sense that the emphasis on KOMs and Strava times can distort the reality of the uneven playing field. No one questions whether speedy multi-thousand-dollar bikes might somehow be “cheating,” yet in some ways it’s not so different from choosing an e-bike. There’s a diversity of bicycles to meet a variety of needs – and that’s a good thing. E-bikes are just one end of the gradient.

[hozn]

@wheels&wings 121727 wrote:

No one questions whether speedy multi-thousand-dollar bikes might somehow be “cheating,” yet in some ways it’s not so different from choosing an e-bike.

I think most [competitive] cyclists would disagree with this statement. Yes, there are some *marginal* performance gains you can get by spending thousands of dollars on a bike. But those gains are minute (e.g. maybe a few watts gained) in comparison to hundreds of watts gained with an e-bike. For those who view cycling as an indicator/expression of physical fitness, battery assistance obviously has no place.

OTOH, I have no idea why people falling into this category would view e-bikes as competition. They’re not playing the game, so not sure why it irks folks when they get passed by an e-bike. The only case where I’d agree it’s “cheating”, is if someone is posting Strava rides [affecting leaderboards] on e-bikes. I would suggest that e-bike rides be banned from sites like Strava that emphasize a competitive fitness aspect of cycling. I don’t know whether that’s in their current TOS or not. Too lazy/busy to look

[dkel]

@hozn 121725 wrote:

Oh, I’m pretty sure it has an [electric] motor, yes. I don’t know how fast it goes. On the sparse W&OD out here it doesn’t seem especially hazardous, but the prospect of that passing cyclists or joggers into potentially oncoming traffic could be terrifying.

From their website:

According to federal guidelines, the top allowable speed using the electric motor only is 20 mph on a flat surface. ELF owners can travel faster by pedaling, some riders regularly go more than 25 mph. The ELF is designed for use under 30 mph.

Not much different from a bicycle, except for the enormity of the thing. I agree about the potential issues passing or being passed by that monster. I bet it’s a fun vehicle, though.

[Crickey7]

I fall into the camp of not worrying about it as long as it’s bike-like, by which I mean looks like a bike (more or less) and doesn’t go appreciably faster than, say, 20 mph or so. Nobody should be going much faster than that on a trail.

[83b]

I posted strava rides on my ebike last year solely for purposes of Freezing Saddles. One day I opened it up going up Capitol Hill to see if I could take the KOM (and then would delete the ride afterwards of course). I seem to recall it only being good for like seventh or eighth place.

[hozn]

@83(b) 121733 wrote:

I posted strava rides on my ebike last year solely for purposes of Freezing Saddles. One day I opened it up going up Capitol Hill to see if I could take the KOM (and then would delete the ride afterwards of course). I seem to recall it only being good for like seventh or eighth place.

Yeah, there is obviously a lot of gray area here. I suppose for freezing saddles e-bikes are allowed; I don’t know that this was ever discussed. I imagine it’s really only controversial if you start winning one of the fitness-related FS challenges (distance/speed/etc.) or, similarly, start top-10 spots on Strava leaderboards.

[jabberwocky]

Strava on e-bikes:
https://strava.zendesk.com/entries/21577916-Uploading-E-bike-motor-assisted-or-non-conventional-bike-data-to-Strava-Guidelines

[Raymo853]

I was once fully against E Bikes on anything but roads, but moderated myself based on a few points people have made. I am still concerned about the upcoming days when E-Bikes will easily be going car speeds. Yes various rules about 1000 watt limits, speed governors, etc. will be hard to enforce when they appear and sound the same.

Hmmm, my future tense may be wrong:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYIJm7101pg
and
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xP6fAPJa7cE

[DismalScientist]

The whole Freezing Saddles team award is also basically distance-related and therefore fitness-related. I certainly remember unsuccessfully chasing E-bike riders up the WOD last winter. Maybe I would feel different if there were bonus points for riding a lugged steel frame.:rolleyes:

That said, I have no problems with E-bikes on the trails if ridden responsibly.

[vern]

@dkel 121719 wrote:

I’ve seen that one, too, out in Vienna, a few times. It is at least as wide as a whole lane on the path. I’ve never had any trouble over it, but I do feel like it’s pushing the limit on trails. At least it isn’t motorized…is it?

I’ve seen this at least a couple times, each just leaving Vienna heading west at evening rush. In that area there is a fair amount of foot and cycling traffic, and I was concerned about other’s safety considering it does use the entire width of the lane. If it’s motorized I don’t think it should be there.

[hozn]

@DismalScientist 121737 wrote:

The whole Freezing Saddles team award is also basically distance-related and therefore fitness-related. I certainly remember unsuccessfully chasing E-bike riders up the WOD last winter. Maybe I would feel different if there were bonus points for riding a lugged steel frame.:rolleyes:

That said, I have no problems with E-bikes on the trails if ridden responsibly.

Yeah, we may wish reconsidering whether e-bikes should be allowed in FS. I don’t have a strong opinion, but you’re right that the overall award is distance-related and it certainly helps to have a motor. We’ll leave that for another thread and try to enjoy the remaining summer

[rcannon100]

You know what really gets me! Those tandem strollers on the trail that hog the entire passage. You know the type. Twins – the parents are the dedicated jogger type. Put their kids in the latest Kids-R-Great-REvenue store hydrollic thingy with mountain bike wheels and suspension. What really gets me though… is just how ugly their kids are.

[GB]

@hozn 121740 wrote:

Yeah, we may wish reconsidering whether e-bikes should be allowed in FS. I don’t have a strong opinion, but you’re right that the overall award is distance-related and it certainly helps to have a motor. We’ll leave that for another thread and try to enjoy the remaining summer

We could put them on a team with the asmatics. But since all the prizes are pointless, I’m going to agree with Canon’s earlier comment and say it applies to BAFS as well (although I’d say it with nicer words and fewwer rainbows). Since strava has an ebike mode option maybe that could be incorporated into the software?

Regarding general ebike use on the trail, Dismal summed it nicely with, “as long as it’s done responsibly”. I doubt that etrike is any harder to control than the fully enclosed recumbents and certainly less unpredictable than a horse or dog.

[DismalScientist]

Yea… Parents with newborn twins should be forced to sell one of them.

No wait… They should wait until they start talking and sell the one that babbles the most.:rolleyes:

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