Cyclelife is Closing

[jrenaut]

@Greenbelt 94389 wrote:

But the main thing that the independents are doing well I think is projecting a friendly overall vibe that tells a prospective customer some important things.

I think this is the most important thing for me. I know if I walk in to the Bike Rack, Bicycle Space, or Proteus, someone will greet me promptly and ask to help. They’ll be friendly and not just try to upsell me to something I don’t want or need. This is the kind of experience that keeps me coming back, and keeps me buying things locally instead of saving a few bucks online.

The other day I was having issues with my pump, so I brought it in to the Bike Rack and they checked it out with me and gave me some advice and didn’t pressure me to spend any money. They treated me like the repeat customer that I am. I ended up buying new gloves because my old ones had crossed the line from “kind of ratty” to “I don’t want to touch that”. It really helps that maybe four of their employees know me by name and another one or two know my Bianchi on sight.

[ebubar]

For me its definitely the service and convenience aspects that take me to the LBS. Occasionally I go to a shop because its close and/or on my way home and I need something quick. For service, Proteus is my go-to place. They understand their customers needs. I needed a courtesy tuneup on my new commuter. Rather than leave the bike with them for a couple of weeks until they cleared their backlog, they put me on a wait-list and called me to bring in the bike when they had time. I was able to keep using my commuter and was only “out” for 1 day. I also wasn’t keeping up with my basic maintenance (chain cleaning and relubing) and needed a new chain. The staff kindly explained that I needed a new chain, told me the exact way to clean it and suggested the frequency of cleaning to keep everything working smoothly. In the long run, this was to save me money on replacing a cassette. A lesser shop would let me continue riding harshly and profit from my poor maintenance. Proteus gave me the knowledge (and tools) to keep things running smoothly longer. I don’t get that service from Amazon.

Plus as Greenbelt says, they recognize women as a customer base. My wife is comfortable stopping at Proteus and gets good service there. They have appropriate bikes and expertise with what women deal with regarding cycling. Other shops don’t always have this expertise.

[ShawnoftheDread]

@Dickie 94386 wrote:

Having worked in a bike shop most of my youth I am much happier doing all the maintenance on my own bikes…

Secret’s out! You’re screwed. Clinics will be at Dickie’s shop every Saturday. See you all there.

[Anonymous]

@rcannon100 94348 wrote:

Question: Why do you go to an LBS? What does an LBS offer you? What do you buy at an LBS?

I have bought two of my three bikes from them, and had a fitting on the third (a craigslist buy). Perhaps someday I will feel knowledgable enough to look at a bike’s specs and geometry online and know it’s what I will want to ride, but unless and until that happens, I want to at least take a bike for a ride before buying it, and possibly get input and advice on selection.

More regularly, maintenance, except for the minimal I do myself. Which, of course, since they’re doing the service I also wind up buying the replacement parts there. Yes, I might pay more buying a chain or cassette from them than online. I am fine with that. I don’t have to worry about if I am buying the right part that is correctly compatible with all the other parts on my bike. And I don’t have to install it.

I rarely buy clothes or gear there. That usually comes from online, for several reasons. 1) ditto jabberwocky, 2) the sheer variety of options I can find with 30 minutes of googling vs. what the shop carries, or what any physical shop realistically can carry, 3) price. If I’m in the shop for other reasons and notice something I can use at a decent price I will pick it up, but I don’t go in specifically to shop for jerseys or whatever.

@rcannon100 94348 wrote:

LBS’s dont really serve us. LBS’s dont serve commuters.

This has not been my experience. (though, technically, I am more a recreational/fitness cyclist than a commuter, but some of both. I don’t think that I’m a Poseur, but I’m also not sure I’d recognize if I were ) (and I really only have experience with one LBS, or two if REI counts).

@Terpfan 94395 wrote:

I would say my LBS is probably Spokes. A lot of that is because they’re directly on my way home from work. My experience there has generally been very good, but I think that’s partially because they have seen me ride by, come in, etc. Literally to the point where they associate my bike with me. They’re a tad expensive; however they often show me what needs to be done and how to tell it’s the root of the problem. While I still probably wouldn’t do some of those replacement type changes, I like learning about them. (I’ll clean/lube my chain, change my flats, minor brake or cable adjustments, but I’m pretty bad going much past that sort of thing). That and they’ll always do minor stuff for me without charging.

This has been my experience. I walk in with a minor problem, they fix it on the spot, for free. They talk to me about what I’m doing right and wrong in my regular maintenance (clean more, oil less). They offer alternatives and make suggestions about up- or down- or sideways- grading parts when I need replacements– based upon them knowing me and having a good idea how I ride. Amazon is great for what Amazon does (drop off new stuff on my porch quickly and reasonably-priced), but will never maintain or repair my bikes for me, and their advice (ie, user reviews) are sometimes useful but often a crapshoot. And, yes, I *could* learn to do much or maybe even all of the maintenance myself, but personally whatever time I have available for spending on my bikes, I’d rather spend riding them than maintaining them.

[mikoglaces]

@GB 94355 wrote:

Great question. I think the future LBS is really a coffee shop / bar that services bikes and showcases gear. People come for the bikes but pay for the food. If Revolution and Java shack were co-located I’d spend more money at both. If Java shack sold beer I’d never leave.

Cyclelife had a great coffee bar. didn’t keep them from losing their lease.

[sethpo]

@mikoglaces 94423 wrote:

Cyclelife had a great coffee bar. didn’t keep them from losing their lease.

A friend of mine knows the owner and says that the entire shop was really just a real estate play. They bought the building for a very good price and “parked” the bike shop there (owner is a cyclist) and didn’t care too much about losing money on the shop since the property was appreciating so fast. They sold the building at a profit and hence are closing the shop.

[nsfnsfdave]

I’ve been doing the Fresh Bikes Arlington Tuesday ride for several years now, and I enjoy it immensely. I know the shop has put alot of effort into getting the police escort set up and helping calm the neighbors down about the 400 riders that storm through on the first Tuesday taco nights (and who the heck pays for the tacos?).

I do all my own repair and maintenance, and I’ve found them to be very helpful when I need a part.
I’m as cheap as anybody, and i used to buy everything on line to save a few $$, but I’ve been supporting them for a couple years because I want the Tuesday ride to continue. I know of many other rides sponsored by other shops that are equally well enjoyed. If we don’t support the LBSs, we may lose more than we might think.

[Bruno Moore]

From talking to people who are also in the biz, it seems that the bike makers are pushing/making bikes for certain market segments—mainly hyperfit young racers and geezers trying to recapture their hyperfit young racer days—who either a) don’t exist; b) got hammered in the recession and no longer have $8,000 to drop on a new crabon toy because someone found a way to split hairs and create a new category of road bike; or c) are hyperfit because biking’s our primary mode of getting around and enjoying ourselves—since we can’t afford to drive anywhere or pay for tickets/drinks/dinner/etc.

I am quite aware that bikemakers think of me as the archetype of a cyclist. I’m a single white overeducated male, should have tons of disposable cash from that high-paying job I scored after grad school (HA!), and races occasionally…like when there’s Nutella afterwards. By their calculations, I’m probably in the market for a fancy new carbon race bike.

Problem is, folks my age have more loan debt than money. A $2,000 road bike is a HUGE investment from our point of view—but, the problem is, that’s barely even what Bicycling considers a “value bike.” Even real racers and neopros can’t pay the kind of money the bikemakers seem to think they can; I remember Phil Gaiman writing in his Velo column to someone wondering how to get something like the pro experience on “just” $10k that they should spend $3k of that on a bike, the rest on a used Toyota…but make sure the interior was okay, because they’d be spending a lot of time sleeping in it.

And yet, the industry keeps trying to think of new ways to split hairs and create new categories of expensive and flashy bikes.

It’s the same panic automakers are facing—folks under 30 aren’t buying cars, don’t want to buy cars, don’t see why they should want to buy cars. There’s no new market coming into its own economically to replace the old one that’s no longer buying the product.

Meanwhile, a lot of people lost their disposable income in the recession and aren’t exactly seeing it come back. Sure, a few people have (re)gained enormous amounts of wealth in the past six years, but that wealth is concentrated in the hands of a few, rather than enough to sustain a thriving retail sector that depends on disposable income. People who make insane amounts of money aren’t going to buy insane numbers of bikes (well, unless they themselves are insanely obsessed, but…); they’re going to buy as many as the enthusiast who makes just enough to justify purchasing that exact same bike: one.

And the market is aging (people who bought touring bikes in the ’70s bought road bikes in the ’80s bought mountain bikes in the ’90s bought carbon endurance bikes in the Lance-fueled ’00s are now buying…what, exactly?). And the scandals of pro men’s World Tour road cycling (notice how specific that was? Notice how it wasn’t just “racing?”) stained the sport side of things. And the perceived snobbishness of roadies kept people away from riding. And the normativaty of the Fit, Skinny White Male in Spandex kept anyone who wasn’t all the above away. And so on.

And yet, so many people keep trying to cater to the same enthusiasts in the same way. Not to commuters, who view “bike expenses” as “non-discresionary transit expenses.” Not to historically marginalized genders, ethnic groups, fitness levels, or socioeconomic classes, who have gotten the message that cycling is not “for them.” Not to actual young people who need cheap and reliable transit that’s also cheap and reliable fun. Not to people who ride their bikes for sport, but in a “less prestigious” discipline like cyclocross. Not, in other words, to the people who are increasingly buying and loving their bicycles and will be the future of cycling.

There are a few impassioned rants I could go on right about now (no, really, I’m just getting started, run away while you still can), but every LBS that goes under, or is struggling, or is having trouble is where somebody learned to love cycling. My own home shop in Oklahoma—where the belief is that transit cycling “just can’t be done”—is still sticking around because of a loyal customer base built up after 40 years of great service, but I’d rather hear that it’s doing better than ever. I imagine the situation is much the same or worse at the eight or so other shops within the same three-mile circle: only so many people who want to or can buy recumbants, tri bikes, and carbon.

There is a future for the LBS—a bright one, even!—but it won’t be selling the same things in the same way to the same people. Between demographic and economic changes, the LBS and the bike industry will also have to change—and, given that this change will probably include making cycling more inclusive, So Be It.

Finally, to jrenaut, who suggested that Proteus charge for coffee: that would mean I would have to start paying. The current scheme is I get it for free because I make it, while everyone else “pays” for it by doing a public service: keeping me from drinking the whole pot myself. There are still stories told about the time I summarized a whole Tour de France stage—in detail, with spoilers included for people who really didn’t want to hear them—in about four seconds after polishing off a liter of French press.

[dplasters]

@Brünø Moore 94453 wrote:

It’s the same panic automakers are facing—folks under 30 aren’t buying cars, don’t want to buy cars, don’t see why they should want to buy cars. There’s no new market coming into its own economically to replace the old one that’s no longer buying the product..

Say what? I mean, on semantics I’d agree. People don’t buy cars anymore, they lease them. Cause they are weird. But I don’t think that was your point.

I can’t say what would get me to shop at a LBS. I’ve never made a single purchase at one… Although the Freshbikes in Fairfax is pretty convenient to me and I know if I had an emergency I’d be going there.

I got into biking as transportation because of MMM. Basing your business model on trying to get my money is going to be hard.

[Henry]

For whatever reason they are closing, we at Phoenix Bikes are sorry to see them go. They have been very supportive of us, and set up monthly parts pick-up that were cast offs from customers upgrading components. Thank you Neil.

And yes, as someone earlier in the thread noted, Phoenix Bikes does sell used parts.

Henry

[Bruno Moore]

@dplasters 94456 wrote:

Say what? I mean, on semantics I’d agree. People don’t buy cars anymore, they lease them. Cause they are weird. But I don’t think that was your point.

What. And what. Also, what.

[KLizotte]

@dplasters 94456 wrote:

I can’t say what would get me to shop at a LBS. I’ve never made a single purchase at one… Although the Freshbikes in Fairfax is pretty convenient to me and I know if I had an emergency I’d be going there.

I got into biking as transportation because of MMM. Basing your business model on trying to get my money is going to be hard.

Ahhhh….the paradox of thrift raises its ugly head.

[dbb]

@dplasters 94456 wrote:

I can’t say what would get me to shop at a LBS. I’ve never made a single purchase at one… Although the Freshbikes in Fairfax is pretty convenient to me and I know if I had an emergency I’d be going there.

You seem to be looking at the LBS similar to the way many people view AAA – as something of an insurance policy. Fact is that AAA charges annual dues regardless of what you actually use. You might want to commit to the purchase of a portion of your annual cycling budget at the LBS as your annual dues. I’d hazard a guess that the incremental costs would be fairly modest. Unlike AAA, you will get stuff you can actually use from your LBS.

[dplasters]

@Brünø Moore 94496 wrote:

What. And what. Also, what.

Appreciate the links. Although two appear to be somewhat anecdotal stories (DC and a guy in Charlotte). With the Charlotte one even having dissenting views in it.

From 2007 to 2011, the number of cars purchased by people aged 18 to 34, fell almost 30%

Given the massive drop in vehicle sales between 2006-2008 and the cash for clunkers program driving many of the sales over that period, I can certainly think of good reasons why young American’s would have been unlikely to purchase a car during that period.

I could be wrong. Perhaps the trend from a deep recession in the market for a large durable good will persist. But if I had to bet on it, I’d doubt it. A good question would be what was the demographics of car purchases between 1979-1985. A fairly comparable drop and rise in overall auto sales.

@dbb 94520 wrote:

You seem to be looking at the LBS similar to the way many people view AAA – as something of an insurance policy. Fact is that AAA charges annual dues regardless of what you actually use. You might want to commit to the purchase of a portion of your annual cycling budget at the LBS as your annual dues. I’d hazard a guess that the incremental costs would be fairly modest. Unlike AAA, you will get stuff you can actually use from your LBS.

I’ve rewritten this section several times to try and not sound like a jerk.. but this is the best I’ve gotten to.

I worked for a large electronics retailer throughout my college days. It went bankrupt my Junior year. I have also sold cell phones and worked at a grocery story and done lots of lovely hourly work selling things to people while in a big box. I have perhaps a very different view than some involving retail.

Its just a store to me. Its no different than Coldstone. I’m not going to stop by Coldstone to pick up a gallon of ice cream just so that the one time a year my wife might want some it is there for her when we are in the Mosiac District (gotta get that birthday cake like it if you know what I mean). Youtube provides me with an endless supply of videos about bike care. Forums like this and many others provide me with even more in-depth information. I price match everything. They have never been cheaper and they have never been close enough to the price I could get elsewhere to warrant the convenience. That is a personal opinion for sure.

The question was posed, what would get “you” into a LBS? An emergency is about it for me. I think most people have pointed out in this thread what the true future of retail is. Its not about the products, its about the experience and service. That is a very tough thing to do. Getting people like me in the first time is really the hardest part. Perhaps my rim will explode tomorrow and they will have a chance to get me. Its not insurance. Its just a store that happens to be located near my commute route. My commute and my purchasing would be the exact same with or without the store there. I am entirely indifferent to its existence.

[sethpo]

I’ll just share this as one example of what’s wrong with the LBS model.

I need a chain for my bike. Because I’m….uh…silly, I let this sneak up on my and didn’t start looking for a chain until my current chain is far too loose. Dumb on me.

Wanting a chain immediately and figuring this was a good way to support the LBS economy, I looked for a chain. A 10-speed chain. I priced them online and all I wanted was a chain that came pretty close in price.

Nope.

One place had no 10-speed chains. Because 10-speed is an uncommon configuration?
One others had more pricey Shimano chains that was much more expensive than I needed.
One had a KMC chain that was far more expensive than available online.
One place didn’t answer their phone at 1130am on a Monday.

So yeah, I ordered my chain from Amazon and it will be here Wednesday.

Maybe there’s a run on 10-speed chains in the D.C. area because maybe everyone has somehow timed their chain replacement needs to create a spike in demand. Or maybe if you are running a bike shop you should really be sure to have such a common item in stock at all times at a competitive price. grrr.

[Author]

Posts