Bad timing

[creadinger]

I was riding down the W&OD today, and got to the intersection with S. George Mason Dr around 5:30 I think. There was 3 seconds left on the cross-walk timer so I continued to cross at speed, knowing I’d be on the other side be the time the light switched. Halfway across the intersection the cars heading north on GM Dr. start to go. I yelled at one guy (which I now feel bad about because….) another cyclist came through the intersection right behind me and he said that the cars started to go because they got a green light! We still had 2 seconds on the cross-walk timer and they got a green light. What the hell?! Is it mis-timed? Does someone need to know about that dangerous situation? We almost got flattened today because of it.

Topic

[brendan]

Never heard of something like that happening before? I would think the traffic/pedestrian timing devices have interlocks to prevent such an occurrence?

Brendan

[baiskeli]

@creadinger 20062 wrote:

I was riding down the W&OD today, and got to the intersection with S. George Mason Dr around 5:30 I think. There was 3 seconds left on the cross-walk timer so I continued to cross at speed, knowing I’d be on the other side be the time the light switched. Halfway across the intersection the cars heading north on GM Dr. start to go. I yelled at one guy (which I now feel bad about because….) another cyclist came through the intersection right behind me and he said that the cars started to go because they got a green light! We still had 2 seconds on the cross-walk timer and they got a green light. What the hell?! Is it mis-timed? Does someone need to know about that dangerous situation? We almost got flattened today because of it.

Are you absolutely sure your three seconds didn’t run out?

The timer is designed to tell you how much time you have to get across after you’ve entered the street on a green, not now much time you have to begin and complete a crossing, by the way. It’s designed for pedestrians going much slower.

In any event, the traffic people should check this possibly dangerous situation.

[consularrider]

My experience at that crossing is that the countdown is to when the 4 Mile Run lateral light turns yellow, not red, so the cross traffic on GM should not have gotten a green if the countdown was still showing either a 1 or 0.

I’ve been experiencing a similar issue with the east bound Ft Myer Dr light at Wilson Blvd. The light turns yellow when the pedestrian light still shows 4 on the countdown and is red as it hits 0.

[creadinger]

@baiskeli 20106 wrote:

Are you absolutely sure your three seconds didn’t run out?

A quick conversion says I was traveling about 17 mph or 25 ft/s = 3 seconds to cross the intersection assuming it’s 7 lanes wide and 10ft lanes. Even if I wouldn’t have technically made it across with the walk sign, I certainly wasn’t slow enough for the timer to run from 3 down to 0, for the light to change to green, for the drivers to notice the green, for them to move their feet from the brake to the gas…. that all takes time.

The timer is designed to tell you how much time you have to get across after you’ve entered the street on a green, not now much time you have to begin and complete a crossing, by the way. It’s designed for pedestrians going much slower.

I know what the timers are for, and yes I’m absolutely sure what I saw. I’m also sure that the 2 cars to my right started to go while I was crossing in front of them with 1-2 seconds left on the cross-walk. It may even be one of those signals that blinks once or twice with the red hand, giving an extra second or two to stragglers.

The only thing that I did not have visual confirmation on was that the light turned green for George Mason Dr. That info was provided by the cyclist behind me who also felt he had time to cross at speed. I can’t think of any other reason why 2 drivers would just spontaneously try to run someone down in a crosswalk so his description sounds plausible. We both agreed that it was an F-ed up situation and we both saw it as the stop light was incorrectly timed with the cross-walk, by a matter of few seconds.

In any event, the traffic people should check this possibly dangerous situation.

I absolutely agree. Who should I contact about it to look into it? I’ve had minor trouble with this cross-walk before. I can’t remember the day or time, but I was waiting with other cyclists and peds on both sides (we each pushed the crosswalk button) and the cycle completely skipped us. We just didn’t get a walk signal so the next time it came around people took it upon themselves to cross without the signal.

[baiskeli]

@creadinger 20124 wrote:

I know what the timers are for

I know, that was my gentle way of suggesting that you wait for the next green to cross.

The only thing that I did not have visual confirmation on was that the light turned green for George Mason Dr. That info was provided by the cyclist behind me who also felt he had time to cross at speed.

Yeah, that clinches it.

I absolutely agree. Who should I contact about it to look into it?

Often just posting here works because our friends at the county notice. Or they can weigh in with who you should call.

[Tim Kelley]

Information on signals can be found here: http://www.arlingtonva.us/Departments/EnvironmentalServices/dot/traffic/signals/EnvironmentalServicesHb16.aspx

There is a telephone number listed that you can use to report issues.

[baiskeli]

…and Tim appears right on cue! Thanks Tim.

[Tim Kelley]

@baiskeli 20157 wrote:

…and Tim appears right on cue! Thanks Tim.

Always watching. Like Batman.

[Dirt]

Creadinger is absolutely right that the lights are not timed correctly. I’m pretty careful at lights and I almost got taken out by this light. Someone’s going to get squished at this intersection.

I stopped to watch the light (in the pouring rain) on my way home today. The light turns green for cross traffic while there is still 5 seconds left on the ticker for people in the crosswalk.

Should people cross while the flashy red hand? Probably not…. but I think most of us do because the walk signals last about 5 seconds in this area. Should they expect that when there’s time still ticking on the flashy red hand that the side traffic isn’t going to get a green light? HELL YES!

I reported it to their automated system. Hopefully it gets fixed soon.

Rock and roll, peeps.

Dirt

[creadinger]

Wow! 5 seconds?! Well it’s great to know that I’m not crazy. It’s not so great knowing that things like this are out there. We seriously could have gotten flattened. And a standard traffic reconstruction would have shown that we were at fault too. Thanks for going over to verify. I think I’ll be a little bit more cautious at crosswalk signals in the future now.

Using the link that Tim posted I sent them an e-mail about it. If I don’t hear back in a few days I’ll call to leave a message too. And thanks to Pete I can be a bit more confident in my description of what is wrong with it.

[Rootchopper]

There is a light at the intersection of Fort Hunt and Collingwood Roads near my house. On the weekends it is set to quickly turn green for waiting vehicles. I found that it actually turns red in all four directions then turns green for cross traffic when triggered by a bike. In other words, you don’t get a green just the expectation of one.

[Riley Casey]

I thought it was the gargoyles that were always watching.

@Tim Kelley 20158 wrote:

Always watching. Like Batman.

[baiskeli]

@Tim Kelley 20158 wrote:

Always watching. Like Batman.

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[consularrider]

I finally had a chance to watch this phenomenon in person heading east on the W&OD at George Mason. The traffic light turned yellow with “5” still showing on the pedestrian signal, and turned red with “1” still showing. I was entering the intersection when the yellow appear and clearing the last of the five traffic lanes when the red appeared, so I was not a position to look and see when the George Mason traffic got the green, but I’m surprised that this timing is still an issue four weeks after it was reported.

[Author]

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