Any riders/commuters lift weights regularly?

[Jason]

I was just wondering, how many of us lift weights regularly, why, how often, for how many years and how intensely. Ill go first:

I have been lifting off and on since highschool (skinny kid). Now, not so skinny, but still lifting because I enjoy it. I lift rather intensely, using an abreviated routine, concentrating on 2-3 sets of 8-10 reps. I lift twice a week, for about an hour each time. First two sets about 85-90% of max, last set is a mass building set just using bodyweight or reduced weight on the bar. I go for full body routines using major joints when I can. I am limted by the gym on my second lifting day of the week. Routine is like this:

Wed: Squat (trap bar Deadlift actually)
Weighted Pullup
Weighted Dip
Curl
Rotator Cuff
Shrug

Sun (no good squat/DL or leg equipment available):
Hammer Iso Row
Hammer Bench
Hammer High Row
Weighted crunch
Weighted Back Extension
Calf Raise
Neck work
Leg Curl

I lift for myself and to keep from looking like a pear as I grow older. I know it isnt going to get any easier. Not trying to impress anybody, I enjoy the act of lifting and the ability to transform my body, even if its slowly.

Topic

[PotomacCyclist]

Massive muscle bulk is not necessary for basic strength and bone density. It’s not completely separate, but many of the basic gains in strength come from neuromuscular improvement, with better coordination of movement patterns and recruitment of more muscle fibers. This does help with general life, especially with core strength and stability and basic strength in the large muscle groups. Bulking up is something separate from general strength and stability for everyday life. Sure, someone who doesn’t lift super heavy isn’t going to be able to pick up a refrigerator. But that’s something I will never do or want to do. If I need something that heavy to be moved, then I’ll get someone else to do it, or have someone use a machine.

Basic strength and stability help with everyday issues such as back pain (which is usually the result of weak core muscles) and lifting modest weights such as groceries. But you don’t really have to be able to squat 600 lbs. to get those benefits.

I know there’s the bodybuilding mindset that everyone should ideally be massively muscular, but that’s really not necessary for the average person. Other than strength athletes like football players and competitive bodybuilders, for everyone else, bulk is something entirely optional. If someone wants to bulk up, that’s a personal choice. But it’s not necessarily the best approach for the non-bodybuilder or non-football player. Strength training for endurance athletes will result in a modest amount of muscle development but it won’t result in a bodybuilding physique. That is by design.

If someone who bikes for fun and commuting wants to do more strength work and he/she has the spare time, I think it’s a good idea to do strength training throughout much of the year. (But some breaks are a good idea.) For those who train for endurance sports like road cycling races and triathlons, year-round heavy lifting is kind of a bad idea. If you go super-hard in strength workouts, you simply won’t have the energy and motivation to do the hard bike (and run and swim) workouts that are necessary at certain times of the year, assuming that person has a goal of improving his/her race performances. During the main part of the season, much of the strength work comes in the form of sport-specific exercises like hill intervals on the bike and/or run. Heavy lifting during those key training phases can disrupt the bike and run training quite a bit. Bodybuilders sometimes lift so heavy on their “leg” days that they have to let the muscles recover for several days afterward, maybe as much as 5 to 7 days.

As an aside, I’ve had some not so pleasant experiences with individuals who are focused on muscle bulk when they aren’t professional athletes. I had one boss who was flat out on steroids or an extreme amount of stimulants. That fellow was simply not right in the head. I had to essentially work with him one-on-one for the better part of two years. Even though it was a professional office setting, I can honestly say that I almost suffered a concussion, a broken hand and a broken ankle during that time — during regular office hours or lunch breaks, not in after-hours recreational sports! He would go into what had to be roid rages, and throw rock-hard objects into the office, sometimes within a couple inches of me. He would give me long lectures about how (exact quote) “caveman society was superior because you were judged on your ability to beat people up.” This is a professional saying this too. He would also get drunk at happy hours attended by many people in the office and one time started screaming about getting one of the women in the office on a pool table that was in front of him. She was in the other room of the bar at the time. And he had a fiancee (now wife, I think).

I know that not every bodybuilding enthusiast is like this. But I remember from when I used to read some of the bodybuilding magazines that almost a third of the entire page count of each issue was devoted to a section covering drugs and other performance enhancers (including IGF and insulin). I was shocked by that. It’s also no secret that modern bodybuilding is based on steroids. I’m not aware of another “sport” where they have to have a separate “natural” division because the mainstream division is assumed to be based on steroids, GH, etc. (Admittedly, sports like baseball, football and cycling have had their steroid/GH problems too. But those sports aren’t built around steroid use the way that pro bodybuilding is.)

[Jason]

Not sure what your discussion of steriods has to do with anything but its a valid observation. Modern bodybuilding is trash. I have never purchased an off the rack bodybuilding magazine in my life. Not really sure how your ex boss or steroid promoting magazines have to do with my previous post though.

The beginning parts of neuromuscular recruitment activity is a good starting point, but I propose, not the same thing as more intensive forms of weight training/bodybuilding. I believe you can have the goal to improve your appearance and physical health but have no interest in drugs or competing. I can tell you from my own experience, that by increasing LEAN bodymass increases at rest fatburning. I am not sure that enhanced neuromusclar recruitment does the same thing. IE, more muscle mass, better fat burning while at rest. This is an added bennefit that doesnt come as readily as if you build strenght without increased mass.

I agree, hard biking and hard lifting dont mix. I bike leisurely and lift hard. Its all about your goals. Here is my calculus:

Bennefit from hard biking: better at hard biking. Fat burning, increased cardio capacity.
Detriment from hard biking: cant lift weights or recover appropriately.

Bennefit from liesurely daily commuter biking: fat burning, increased cardio, can still lift weights and recover appropriately (after acclimitization to routine)
Detriment: not as good at biking

Bennefits from weight training: Increased bone density, increased at rest fat burning, increased muscle tone and mass (good for old age)
Detriments: cant bike hard.

It seems that biking hard and weight training hard are mutually exclusive so:
For me, its better to bike liesurely and weight train intensively (and abbreviated) because I gain more than if I only biked heavy. Also, I really dont think my wife would notice neuromuscular recruitment activity as much as she has noticed my mass building + daily cardio from commuting, if you catch my drift

[JorgeGortex]

@krazygl00 27706 wrote:

Great post. I come from the opposite end of the spectrum — it is a constant battle to keep the weight *off* of me. Realize that in a cycling forum there are a whole lot of fatguys reading your post, grumbling with envy about you needing to bulk up

I’ve never been good at calisthenics, but then I’ve never followed a regimen, so I may have to check out that hundred-pushup plan. Also, that Navy Seal workout…I remember seeing a book on that and it was all gravity-based, body-weight type exercises. No equipment required…is that the same plan you’re talking about? Please do share!

As I’ve hit mumble-mumble-*cough* years old I’ve definitely seen a decline in upper body strength (fortunately the legs are as strong as ever). I even have some elbow and shoulder pain when doing strenuous tasks, so I think I definitely need to improve the strength and flexibility there.

Gloo, the Navy SEAL workout I mention, for push-ups is from here: http://perfectonline.com/downloads/PUSHup_Getting_Started_Poster.pdf

I’ve found it works pretty well with or without the Perfect Push-up handles. I have them, but have been doing them the old fashioned way. So, yeah, I don’t know that it is a true SEAL workout at any level. Agreed that body weight exercises, of which there are plenty of variants, are great. You can build good strength because they engage all the support and core muscles at the same time. Add a balance ball or similar devices to the mix and you can really get a good workout. I think a combo of true weight training and body weight exercises is the way to go.

Everyone can use to get a bit a stronger and more flexible. Go for it!

Yeah, I understand that I am coming from the lucky side, but believe me that being the skinniest guy around has its draw backs when you are younger too.

[JorgeGortex]

Potomac, I have to agree with Jason on this one. I am not sure how steroid use got into the conversation, as no one here would advocate their use. They really cause more harm than good. I’m sorry you had a bad experience with some body builders or weight lifters. There are some real meat heads out there… but I don’t think they speak for the sport. Heck, you only have to go out in Clarendon anymore to run into a whole passle of bros doing the same crap without the steroid use. Ah, society.

I for one start bulking up whenever I start lifting, using body weight or iron. Its a natural progression. You can gain strength through lighter weight and more reps, but for real strength gains you have to lift heavier, with lower reps. When you do that, bulking up is a natural expression of the work. Muscle fibers naturally grow as a result of the stress introduced upon them by lifting. Now, whether that is important to an individual or not is up to each person. Bulk is also irrelevant to cycling, but certainly won’t impede it… unless you grow to the proportions of some body builders.

On that topic, I always enjoyed looking through those mags, Jason, merely for inspiration. Its cool to see the human body pushed to those levels. And it may be less the case in the sport, but there are some body builders who are clean. They may not get all the attention, but they are out there. Guys like Steve Reeves, Reg Park, and the like. OK, they aren’t modern, but ya know.

In any case its a challenge to fit in a longer commute by bike and maintain the energy to lift hard too. Or vice versa (if you think of Olympic lifts as they take so much out of you). But hey, its fun to try!

JG

@PotomacCyclist 27800 wrote:

Massive muscle bulk is not necessary for basic strength and bone density. It’s not completely separate, but many of the basic gains in strength come from neuromuscular improvement, with better coordination of movement patterns and recruitment of more muscle fibers. This does help with general life, especially with core strength and stability and basic strength in the large muscle groups. Bulking up is something separate from general strength and stability for everyday life. Sure, someone who doesn’t lift super heavy isn’t going to be able to pick up a refrigerator. But that’s something I will never do or want to do. If I need something that heavy to be moved, then I’ll get someone else to do it, or have someone use a machine.

Basic strength and stability help with everyday issues such as back pain (which is usually the result of weak core muscles) and lifting modest weights such as groceries. But you don’t really have to be able to squat 600 lbs. to get those benefits.

I know there’s the bodybuilding mindset that everyone should ideally be massively muscular, but that’s really not necessary for the average person. Other than strength athletes like football players and competitive bodybuilders, for everyone else, bulk is something entirely optional. If someone wants to bulk up, that’s a personal choice. But it’s not necessarily the best approach for the non-bodybuilder or non-football player. Strength training for endurance athletes will result in a modest amount of muscle development but it won’t result in a bodybuilding physique. That is by design.

If someone who bikes for fun and commuting wants to do more strength work and he/she has the spare time, I think it’s a good idea to do strength training throughout much of the year. (But some breaks are a good idea.) For those who train for endurance sports like road cycling races and triathlons, year-round heavy lifting is kind of a bad idea. If you go super-hard in strength workouts, you simply won’t have the energy and motivation to do the hard bike (and run and swim) workouts that are necessary at certain times of the year, assuming that person has a goal of improving his/her race performances. During the main part of the season, much of the strength work comes in the form of sport-specific exercises like hill intervals on the bike and/or run. Heavy lifting during those key training phases can disrupt the bike and run training quite a bit. Bodybuilders sometimes lift so heavy on their “leg” days that they have to let the muscles recover for several days afterward, maybe as much as 5 to 7 days.

As an aside, I’ve had some not so pleasant experiences with individuals who are focused on muscle bulk when they aren’t professional athletes. I had one boss who was flat out on steroids or an extreme amount of stimulants. That fellow was simply not right in the head. I had to essentially work with him one-on-one for the better part of two years. Even though it was a professional office setting, I can honestly say that I almost suffered a concussion, a broken hand and a broken ankle during that time — during regular office hours or lunch breaks, not in after-hours recreational sports! He would go into what had to be roid rages, and throw rock-hard objects into the office, sometimes within a couple inches of me. He would give me long lectures about how (exact quote) “caveman society was superior because you were judged on your ability to beat people up.” This is a professional saying this too. He would also get drunk at happy hours attended by many people in the office and one time started screaming about getting one of the women in the office on a pool table that was in front of him. She was in the other room of the bar at the time. And he had a fiancee (now wife, I think).

I know that not every bodybuilding enthusiast is like this. But I remember from when I used to read some of the bodybuilding magazines that almost a third of the entire page count of each issue was devoted to a section covering drugs and other performance enhancers (including IGF and insulin). I was shocked by that. It’s also no secret that modern bodybuilding is based on steroids. I’m not aware of another “sport” where they have to have a separate “natural” division because the mainstream division is assumed to be based on steroids, GH, etc. (Admittedly, sports like baseball, football and cycling have had their steroid/GH problems too. But those sports aren’t built around steroid use the way that pro bodybuilding is.)

[Jason]

+ for Reg Park and Steve Reeves and all the rest of the old time bodybuilders in the pre-sterioids era.

Just as a follow on, I dont see the point of body-weight lifting except for beginers or people with too much bodyfat. If somebody is lean, it shouldnt take even a year to make bodyweight only exercise anything more than a warm-up or cardio.

[JeffC]

I commute pretty regularly, racking up about 2000 miles a year. For about a year I did an experiment trying to lose some weight. I got a Bod Pod test beforehand and was discouraged by my bodyfat percentage (around 29%). For a period of slightly over a year, I dilligently did 5 of the Convict Conditioning moves for strength training once per week (all but the head stands/shoulder press movement) and biked to work regularly. After roughly a year, I got a DEXA scan test and while I lost nearly 16 lbs about half was fat and half was muscle so my body fat percentage did not go down nearly as much as I would have liked given the amount of weight I lost. I was also told that I had low bone mineral density overall although in my hips and lower back it was good.

I just don’t think that cycling alone and Convict Conditioning were a good combo for me to lose weight and preserve my muscle mass. Since then I have tried to focus more on heavy deadlifts once a week and heavy clean and presses once a week, just to preserve what I have (and maybe grow a bit) while overall trying to lose weight. This is kind of the template from the book “Power to the People.”

[Jason]

I would skip the clean and press, which is a high difficulty olympic lift and instead do deadlift one day and squat another. That way, then add in a pressing movement (dumbell press or bench press) and a pulling movement (row) and you should be good to go. Sounds like the combination of non-weight bearing lifting and a high amount of cardio sucked away your muscle. Maybe another issue was caloric intake, if you go under a certain amount, your body starts eating itself, maybe that contributed to your muscle loss.

[JorgeGortex]

@Jason 28090 wrote:

+ for Reg Park and Steve Reeves and all the rest of the old time bodybuilders in the pre-sterioids era.

Just as a follow on, I dont see the point of body-weight lifting except for beginers or people with too much bodyfat. If somebody is lean, it shouldnt take even a year to make bodyweight only exercise anything more than a warm-up or cardio.

To each their own I guess… and every body is different (no pun intended). I am an experienced lifter… at 130lbs I was one able to 1RM 200lbs. for bench. I still can get a workout from body weight stuff. Shocking the body in different ways, the bonus of strengthening stabilizer muscles. Whatever works for a person is what’s best.

JG

[JorgeGortex]

@Jason 28100 wrote:

Maybe another issue was caloric intake, if you go under a certain amount, your body starts eating itself, maybe that contributed to your muscle loss.

Its also a matter of what you eat. A healthier diet is going to help with the lowering of body fat percentage no matter if you are doing body weight or iron workouts.

An alternative to the clean and press movement is a related one I do: load up a dumbell and place it in front of you. Squat down and grab the handle with both hands. Now, execute the movement as you would a clean- straight arms, chin up, back flat, core blocking. Drive hips and knees up bringing the weight off the floor, keep the momentum up and bring weight past shoulders and press over head until arms are straight. I usually alternate pressing to either side of my head for each rep. Return weight to floor in controlled manner and then immediate spring back up for next rep. Not sure if these have a name already, but I jokingly call them baby throws. A nice all body lift.

[JeffC]

@Jason 28100 wrote:

I would skip the clean and press, which is a high difficulty olympic lift and instead do deadlift one day and squat another. That way, then add in a pressing movement (dumbell press or bench press) and a pulling movement (row) and you should be good to go. Sounds like the combination of non-weight bearing lifting and a high amount of cardio sucked away your muscle. Maybe another issue was caloric intake, if you go under a certain amount, your body starts eating itself, maybe that contributed to your muscle loss.

I should have been clear that I don’t do barbell clean and press olympic style but rather kettlebell clean and press which is not nearly as technically demanding. Part of my problem is that I don’t have a barbell at home, only kettlebells and sandabags. At my work, there is a very small gym with a couple barbells so one day a week after biking in, I can do a couple sets of heavy deadlifts (working up to 2 x bodyweight) and then do some sets of kettlebell clean and presses at home.

I think there is a law of diminishing returns with chronic cardio, too much at the expense of heavy lifting may zap your muscles and certainly increases your appetite.

[Jason]

@JeffC 28156 wrote:

I should have been clear that I don’t do barbell clean and press olympic style but rather kettlebell clean and press which is not nearly as technically demanding. Part of my problem is that I don’t have a barbell at home, only kettlebells and sandabags. At my work, there is a very small gym with a couple barbells so one day a week after biking in, I can do a couple sets of heavy deadlifts (working up to 2 x bodyweight) and then do some sets of kettlebell clean and presses at home.

I think there is a law of diminishing returns with chronic cardio, too much at the expense of heavy lifting may zap your muscles and certainly increases your appetite.

Totally agree on all points. I dont lift so heavy anymore, keeping my sets to 8 reps each. Although, I still lift very intensively, but the high rep count keeps me relatively safe. (my workout partner thinks I am crazy to tie on 20lbs for pullups and 35lbs for dips) One thing to consider with working out at home: Since you already have the deadlift capability at work, you could consider getting a trap bar for home use, no rack needed. Working with it looks like a deadlift, but instead its actually more like a squat. That might be too much however in one week with the deadlifting AND biking, but it would give you a more full leg workout than the deadlifts, and since its on seperate days, I feel it wouldnt likely be too much.

Also agree on diet, I eat SUPER healthy, its kind of sickening actually. But since my wife and I are on target with it, its actually more just our lifestyle, not a diet. I think we figured out that we eat on average 10 servings of fruit and vegetables a day. (harvard med suggests 5-13 per day). On top of that I get about 150g of protein on non-workout days, more like 180g on workout days (due to an extra helping of milk that I dont consume most days).

but, you have to work within the confines of what you have by being creative. In some ways I have similar issues, but an awesome gym at work (free) and basically just an upperbody gym at the apartment building I live at. Upside is that all the upper body stuff is plate loaded hammer strength machines (pretty much the best ever for machines we have high row, iso row, bench, and incline bench). Sooo, I lift intensively for upper body on the weekend, along with back extensions, calf work, neck, and abs, I get it all done. The at work gym lets me do (once a week) squats (using a trap bar since they actually have one), stiff legged deadlifts, pull ups (since there is no good pull up bar at home), dips, and overhead press.

[mstone]

@JorgeGortex 28134 wrote:

Not sure if these have a name already, but I jokingly call them baby throws.

I refer to squats generally as “knee-killers”.

[pfunkallstar]

I don’t work my legs out anymore – 100+ miles a week does that pretty well. I took a look at Convict Conditioning and it is pretty much what I already do, albeit more formalized. I REALLY like body weight-only exercises, I’m looking to tone not build muscle.

[Jason]

@mstone 28190 wrote:

I refer to squats generally as “knee-killers”.

Why? If you do them properly, they are not hard on the knees at all. Proper stance, keep knee from going over toe or instep, squat nice and slowly to the correct depth for your anatomy. Bar doesnt feel right on back? Try parallel bar deadlifts (squat with bar from floor really). If your knees wont work with squats, its either because of an injury, you are not flexible enough, or you are doing them wrong.

As far as toning, no such thing. Toning is code for small muscles with reduced fat, making the muscles seem bigger. Nothing wrong with that, but its misleading to think that “toning” has anything to do with building any amount of visible muscle or with building strenght.

Also, if you think 100 miles a week = inability to build muscle, I dont believe it. It will reduce muscle building ability because biking that much will reduce overall recovery reserves. However, if you lifted once a week, with squat/deadlift, one push (bench, dips, press) one pull (row, chinup) you would see a good improvement in your muscle development. Sorry to come across as rude, this thread is about lifting for people who also bike, not for “I cant lift because I bike” excuses. I believe it is possible to do both, even if I agree that biking does inhibit some recovery if done over a certain amount. Its about priorities, and for some of us, overall health involves a great deal of muscle development along with cardio.

[mstone]

@Jason 28212 wrote:

Sorry to come across as rude, this thread is about lifting for people who also bike, not for[…]

Sorry, will leave the thread immediately to make room for the bodybuilders! (Where do these stereotypes originate?)

[Author]

Replies