Airless tires…

[GuyContinental]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYa9RhUkxoI

Michelin, Bridgestone and these “ERW” guys have been at this in automotive since around 2002 but no one has solved some of the durability and foreign-object issues with car tires. However, it looks like ERW is shifting to bikes as a less regulated market. I like the concept (especially as someone who constantly pinch-flats) but at least from the videos, they look overly stiff. Also, not being able to adjust pressure for trail conditions would be a bummer as would having to shake sand out of your wheels after riding not to mention the 65 pounds you would gain after riding through a boggy section of trail.

Has anyone seen these? Maybe at Interbike?

Topic

[jopamora]

Grandkids – “Hey, Grandpa did your bike tires really have air in them?”
Grandpa – “Back in my day we had to walk 5 miles through the snow to get tire levers to change our flat tires”

[mstone]

obligatory sheldon quote:

Airless Tires

Of all the inventions that came out of the bicycle industry, probably none is as important and useful as Dr. Dunlop’s pneumatic tire.

Airless tires have been obsolete for over a century, but crackpot “inventors” keep trying to bring them back. They are heavy, slow and give a harsh ride. They are also likely to cause wheel damage, due to their poor cushioning ability. A pneumatic tire uses all of the air in the whole tube as a shock absorber, while foam-type “airless” tires/tubes only use the air in the immediate area of impact.

Pneumatic tires require pumping up from time to time, and can go flat, but their advantages overwhelm these difficulties.

Airless tire schemes have also been used by con artists to gull unsuspecting investors. My advice is to avoid this long-obsolete system.

(from http://sheldonbrown.com/tires.html)

Maybe someone will pull out a miracle, but I’ll remain skeptical.

[baiskeli]

Next thing you’ll be telling me is they have wireless telephones! Impossible!

[Tim Kelley]

Or tubeless tires!!

[mstone]

If these were really so great, people would be beating a path to their door, instead of them searching for a market for a decade. As currently proposed, this thing is a dog. It will fill up with gunk, then rip itself apart as it becomes a solid tire. Put a cover on it that’s durable enough to not tear, and you’ve lost most of the purported advantage. If you get a tear and don’t notice, your wheel fills with gunk and tears itself apart. The claims on the web page are written like complete snake oil. Can all this be made to work in a viable product? Maybe, but this isn’t it, and it will take decades of refinement to get to where pneumatic tires are after more than a century of research. Bottom line: changing a flat isn’t that big a deal and it’s something we know how to do. I’m certainly not going to trade that (fairly rare) inconvenience for the immensely greater problem of having to replace one of several dozen carbon nanotube springs on the side of the road.

[baiskeli]

@mstone 41339 wrote:

If these were really so great, people would be beating a path to their door, instead of them searching for a market for a decade. As currently proposed, this thing is a dog. It will fill up with gunk, then rip itself apart as it becomes a solid tire. Put a cover on it that’s durable enough to not tear, and you’ve lost most of the purported advantage. If you get a tear and don’t notice, your wheel fills with gunk and tears itself apart. The claims on the web page are written like complete snake oil. Can all this be made to work in a viable product? Maybe, but this isn’t it, and it will take decades of refinement to get to where pneumatic tires are after more than a century of research. Bottom line: changing a flat isn’t that big a deal and it’s something we know how to do. I’m certainly not going to trade that (fairly rare) inconvenience for the immensely greater problem of having to replace one of several dozen carbon nanotube springs on the side of the road.

Okay, Mr. Sunshine.

[vvill]

I’ve seen this video before which is the same technology/company and was quite impressed with what I saw.

I think they have a couple issues even before cost and durability though. As with the car version the design looks like it’d be easy for dirt and especially mud to get stuck inside, and the suppleness/cornering is another question. If it was dry though and you weren’t doing anything too technical it looks like it’d be a nice saving on rotating weight.

[Paulver]

Airless tires for consumer cars or bikes have some way to go yet before they reach commercial stage. However, progress is being made with Michelin releasing their Tweel ‘tire’ towards the end of last year. Currently the Tweel is only available for slow speed applications but it is being commercialized after many years of research.
I found some useful info here: http://www.airless-tire.com/

[Nicholas23]

The benefits of tubeless tires are clear for mountain bike applications. You must use a liquid latex sealant with these tires, which do a wonderful job of quickly sealing most types of punctures.
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[PotomacCyclist]

@GuyContinental 41317 wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYa9RhUkxoI

Michelin, Bridgestone and these “ERW” guys have been at this in automotive since around 2002 but no one has solved some of the durability and foreign-object issues with car tires. However, it looks like ERW is shifting to bikes as a less regulated market. I like the concept (especially as someone who constantly pinch-flats) but at least from the videos, they look overly stiff. Also, not being able to adjust pressure for trail conditions would be a bummer as would having to shake sand out of your wheels after riding not to mention the 65 pounds you would gain after riding through a boggy section of trail.

Has anyone seen these? Maybe at Interbike?

Do you check your tire pressure before each ride? I always do before I ride on skinny road/tri tires. I’ve never had a single pinch flat or puncture flat either. (It could be that I’m a bit lighter than most.)

However, I don’t check the MTB tires as often. Maybe once a week or so.

[hozn]

@Nicholas23 47287 wrote:

The benefits of tubeless tires are clear for mountain bike applications. You must use a liquid latex sealant with these tires, which do a wonderful job of quickly sealing most types of punctures.

I agree – can’t imagine riding a mountain bike with tubes after a few years of tubeless. Figured that road tubeless would make just as much sense, but I think I was wrong there. I still ride road tubeless, but I have found the liquid latex won’t seal punctures at over 40-60psi. Also pinch flatting, while greatly reduced, is still a concern in the situation where the tire is cut by the rim (usually against some foreign object). That has been especially relevant when running low pressure tubeless CX tires on MTB trails

[Author]

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