Working with the NPS GWMP on snow removal – comments by 2 March

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  • February 25, 2016 at 3:17 pm #1048334
    dbb
    Participant

    I’ll start

    Clear the path from the wooden bridge over Boundary Channel Drive through the LBJ Memorial Grove to the Columbia Island parking lot

    Clear from the Columbia Island Marina parking lot over the Humpback bridge and up the the start of the 14th Street Bridge

    February 25, 2016 at 3:33 pm #1048335
    Anonymous
    Guest

    For those of us more southern, Belle Haven Marina to Old Town Alexandria is essential to getting across the Beltway.

    February 25, 2016 at 3:38 pm #1048337
    CaseyKane50
    Participant

    Clear Trail from Washington Street (south of Woodrow Wilson Bridge) to South Royal Street.

    Clear Trail from Belle View Boulevard to Woodrow Wilson Bridge

    Pre-treat entire trail in advance of forecasted storm (this is likely to be a stretch, but might mitigate need to clear critical locations when we get 3-5″ snowfall)

    February 25, 2016 at 4:01 pm #1048342
    DismalScientist
    Participant

    Clear from the south sidewalk of Memorial Bridge to where the Pentagon stops shoveling the Washington Blvd bike path (Washington Blvd bridge over Boundary Channel?)

    IF the sidewalk of Roosevelt Bridge is cleared, clear the MVT from Lynn/Lee to Roosevelt Bridge.

    February 25, 2016 at 4:05 pm #1048343
    bobco85
    Participant

    I would prefer that the NPS did the following:

    • Pre-treat and plow:
      • Boundary Channel Bridge -> Columbia Island Marina -> MVT -> Humpback Bridge -> 14th St Bridge (about 0.9 miles)
      • Crystal City Connector -> MVT -> 14th St Bridge (about 2.0 miles)
      • Belle Haven Marina -> MVT -> Royal Street in Old Town (up to and past the Wilson Bridge, about 1.4 miles)
    • Pre-treat (there is some overlap here):
      • MVT from Memorial Bridge -> Belle Haven Marina (about 8.0 miles excluding on-road segments)
      • the rest of the MVT if possible (about 9.0 miles remaining)
    February 25, 2016 at 4:06 pm #1048344
    chawkins72
    Participant

    Please clear from the 14th St. Bridge to Crystal City.

    February 25, 2016 at 4:40 pm #1048350
    MFC
    Participant

    @bobco85 135588 wrote:

    I would prefer that the NPS did the following:

    • Pre-treat and plow:
      • Boundary Channel Bridge -> Columbia Island Marina -> MVT -> Humpback Bridge -> 14th St Bridge (about 0.9 miles)
      • Crystal City Connector -> MVT -> 14th St Bridge (about 2.0 miles)
      • Belle Haven Marina -> MVT -> Royal Street in Old Town (up to and past the Wilson Bridge, about 1.4 miles)
    • Pre-treat (there is some overlap here):
      • MVT from Memorial Bridge -> Belle Haven Marina (about 8.0 miles excluding on-road segments)
      • the rest of the MVT if possible (about 9.0 miles remaining)

    Just out of curiosity, why are you suggesting that they only pretreat the section of the MVT between Old Town/Oronoco Park and the Crystal City Connector, but pretreat and plow other sections of the MVT north and south of there? It seems like you would have a huge section that would not be plowed. Cost/feasibility?

    February 25, 2016 at 4:44 pm #1048352
    dasgeh
    Participant

    1. Downstream sidepath of the Memorial Bridge

    2. Sidewalks connecting ANC Metro/110 Trail to downstream sidepath of the Memorial Bridge

    3. LBJ bridge + connection from Marina to MVT + MVT to 14th St Bridge

    4. The block of Lynn Street just south of the Key Bridge.

    5. Belle Haven Marina to Old Town Alexandria

    6. 27 Trail to Memorial Bridge

    7. IoD to TR Bridge

    8. Upstream sidepath of Memorial Bridge & connecting sidewalks

    9. MVT from CC Connector to 14th Street Bridge

    [Probably other sections south of FMR that I’m not familiar with]

    10. Rest of MVT

    February 25, 2016 at 5:00 pm #1048358
    bentbike33
    Participant

    Let’s start with some preventive measures that should cost very little and speed access via melting to the MVT after a snow event, to wit:

    1. Remove the snow fences at the approaches to the Humpback Bridge and any other snow fences adjacent to the trail. They make things worse. Snow fences may make sense in wide-open areas of the MVT like Gravelly Point, but they need to be placed well back from the trail to be effective.

    2. Do not dump snow cleared from adjacent facilities onto the MVT.

    February 25, 2016 at 5:06 pm #1048359
    bobco85
    Participant

    @MFC 135595 wrote:

    Just out of curiosity, why are you suggesting that they only pretreat the section of the MVT between Old Town/Oronoco Park and the Crystal City Connector, but pretreat and plow other sections of the MVT north and south of there? It seems like you would have a huge section that would not be plowed. Cost/feasibility?

    I figured that the MVT is not likely to be fully treated and/or plowed due to funding, so I was prioritizing sections based on the availability of alternate routes. I figured that trying to convince the NPS to focus on treating and plowing the 3 sections I listed would be a good starting place as they total only 4.3 miles.

    The section of the MVT between Oronoco Park and the Crystal City Connector could be traveled using the alternate route of neighborhood streets -> Braddock Road access to Potomac Yard Trail -> Crystal Drive bike lane -> Crystal City Connector since Alexandria plows the PYT.

    February 25, 2016 at 8:00 pm #1048391
    dragonflycrk
    Participant

    Mt. Vernon Trail from 14th St. Bridge to Crystal City

    February 25, 2016 at 8:13 pm #1048393
    Oldtowner
    Participant

    It wasn’t a problem this year, but in previous years there has been a problem with ice on the MVT overpasses that kept refreezing everyday. Some kind of treatment on those would be helpful.

    As for plowing, my backup to the MVT is the PYT and through LBJ. The LBJ connector should be a priority.

    February 25, 2016 at 8:16 pm #1048394
    PBS
    Participant

    Pretty much the entire Arlington Loop needs to be cleared. For the MVT, that means the entire section from Four Mile Run to the Custice needs to be available to regular commuters.

    If we can’t get that, I at least need excellent updates on what’s clear. Once I start on the Four Mile Run section of my commute, I’m committed. Finding a wall of snow at a random part of the trail doesn’t mean I get to turn down a nearby street like the cars do, it means I have nowhere to go but back. Unless I have a reliable indication of what’s clear and what’s not, I can’t risk it.

    BTW, I know this is NPS territory, but it’s also Arlington. Any way Arlington could fork over some cash to help with the plowing?

    (I picked the Arlington loop because I’m an Arlington resident, who works in Arlington and I’m posting on Bike Arlington. It’s not that I don’t care about everyone else. IMHO, the whole thing should be plowed.)

    February 25, 2016 at 8:23 pm #1048395
    lordofthemark
    Participant

    I am a City of Alexandria resident, but the only parts of the MVT I rely on for commuting are the Arlington parts, from the 4MRT to the 14th Street bridge. If clearing all of that is not possible, I would want from the Crystal City underpass to the 14th Street bridge. I would also especially appreciate the part over the Humpback through the marina to the wooden bridge to the Pentagon for three reasons A If the two options I mention above are not possible, that would provide a route to Crystal City and Eads Street B. If the two options above were not possible, I could use that to access the buses at Pentagon metro station C. In some conditions I would go the Pentagon metro station anyway.

    February 25, 2016 at 8:50 pm #1048396
    DismalScientist
    Participant

    @PBS 135640 wrote:

    Pretty much the entire Arlington Loop needs to be cleared. For the MVT, that means the entire section from Four Mile Run to the Custis needs to be available to regular commuters.

    If we can’t get that, I at least need excellent updates on what’s clear. Once I start on the Four Mile Run section of my commute, I’m committed. Finding a wall of snow at a random part of the trail doesn’t mean I get to turn down a nearby street like the cars do, it means I have nowhere to go but back. Unless I have a reliable indication of what’s clear and what’s not, I can’t risk it.

    BTW, I know this is NPS territory, but it’s also Arlington. Any way Arlington could fork over some cash to help with the plowing?

    (I picked the Arlington loop because I’m an Arlington resident, who works in Arlington and I’m posting on Bike Arlington. It’s not that I don’t care about everyone else. IMHO, the whole thing should be plowed.)

    The W&OD between Shirlington and Custis is controlled by NVRPA, not NPS. It is my understanding that they refused Arlington’s offer to clear it for free.

    Here’s the street route to avoid that part of the W&OD between Shirlington and the Custis (you really only have to worry about the part between Columbia Pike and the Custis.):
    https://www.google.com/maps/dir/38.8440616,-77.0857817/38.8789501,-77.127792/@38.857256,-77.1115997,14.25z/data=!4m29!4m28!1m25!3m4!1m2!1d-77.113138!2d38.8653747!3s0x89b7b41a602cb61d:0x499df087d7c0f1af!3m4!1m2!1d-77.1121595!2d38.8702318!3s0x89b7b419b1845da9:0xcb6848de0f6fab4e!3m4!1m2!1d-77.1135669!2d38.8726265!3s0x89b7b4181ba40549:0xe1ec93fb7c4dc919!3m4!1m2!1d-77.1191383!2d38.8752519!3s0x89b7b43de5af9e13:0xbdf293d8d8c6fae9!3m4!1m2!1d-77.1239223!2d38.877647!3s0x89b7b43f731bcea1:0xee9c87b658c33998!1m0!3e0

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