Advice needed: Should I switch from 2X10 to 1X11 on a touring bike

This topic has 81 replies, 25 voices, and was last updated 6 years, 8 months ago by peterw_diy.

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November 18, 2015 at 8:11 pm #917592

bluerider
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As some of you know, I built a custom Salsa Vaya a couple of years ago. It has a SRAM X9 mountain bike group on it geared at 42/28 double crank and a 12-36 cassette. The full build is here. THIS IS NOT A MOUNTAIN BIKE. The bike gets a lot of use and will need some drivetrain attention relatively soon so I am thinking about taking advantage for this future maintenance to upgrade. I like this setup a lot with the exception of the front derailleur. I have had issues with chain suck and jammed drivetrains over the last few months. It has been recently tuning and dialed in as well but the front of the drivetrain continues to be somewhat problematic.

This hasn’t been a huge deal because the bike generally stays in the big ring except for the worst hills or when fully loaded. But its annoying and I have been tempted to transition to one of SRAM’s new 1X11 mountain bike groups such as GX or X1. My White Industries hub will accept the freehub body to install the 10-42 cassette and I can easily use the mountain bike trigger shifter with a Paul mount. Here is the thing: I see lots of reviews online for cross and mountain bikes but not much in terms of touring style bikes with any load. This bike functions as a commuter, loading tourer on pavement and gravel. It has done the GAP/C&O with 60 lbs. of gear. The bike weighs about 28-30 lbs unloaded I’d guess including full front and rear racks with fenders. It pedals along at 27-28 mph without much trouble and the gearing to low enough to handle pretty much anything loaded. But I hate the derailleur and simplifying is a good thing. So is considering a 1X11 setup on a bike like this a mistake?

I want to stay with a mountain bike group for the durability and my bike is already setup for it. So, considering SRAM GX or X1 with 34 or 36 tooth crank and the 10-42 cassette. In this scenario, I would change to whole group set: shifter, rear derailleur, cassette, freehub and crankset. As long as I can pedal along on 20-25 mph I’ll be happy.

Has anyone done this? Should I ditch the front derailleur? Any advice? Too big of gaps between gears with a bike like this? Will I be walking up hills?

Thanks in advance.
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November 18, 2015 at 8:45 pm #1041405

Steve O
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@bluerider 128202 wrote:

Has anyone done this? Should I ditch the front derailleur? Any advice? Too big of gaps between gears with a bike like this? Will I be walking up hills?

Thanks in advance.

I have a Fuji touring bike that I use for commuting, every day riding and recreational riding, including centuries, WABA rides, etc.. The front derailleur broke prior to Freezing Saddles last year. I put it on the middle ring and left it there all winter. In the spring I ditched the FD and went with a 1×9 with a chain protector on the outside. My smallest gear is 42/32.
It’s three fewer things to break, all of which have broken on me in the past: shifter, cable, and derailleur.

My chain was still occasionally dropping to the inside when I hit bumps, but I added one of these the day before Kill Bill:
[ATTACH=CONFIG]10106[/ATTACH]

That kept my chain on for the whole ride. It’s only dropped 2-3 times in the 5 months since.
I love not having to worry about a front derailleur. Having 10 or 11 gears might be better, but for me just marginally. I originally had wanted to go with 46/36 as my lowest gear, but I seem to be fine with this setup.

The number of gears people have now seems to be out of control (although I understand the need for low gears on MTBs). My 1×9 has more options than the original 10-speeds I had back in my youth, and cyclists were winning the Tour de France on bikes like those.

So, in short, yes. Ditch the front derailleur and give yourself 10 or 11 gears that will serve your riding needs. You don’t need more than that.

November 18, 2015 at 9:06 pm #1041408

DismalScientist
Participant

The only thing that I would worry about with a “touring” bike is the gear range. It doesn’t matter whether it is achieved by a 1×11, 2×10 or 3×6, for that matter. I would think about just going 1×10 if you can find a chain ring that meets your needs with the 12-36 cassette. In general, with a 1×10, the only thing you would have to change is the cassette and crank.

November 18, 2015 at 9:21 pm #1041409

Emm
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I cant comment on your specific gearing question since I don’t off the top of my head know the ratios your looking at good enough, but I can comment on only having 11 gears, since that’s what my alfine IGH provides me. I don’t find the lack of gears slows me down much at all. The heaviness of the bike I’m riding impacts me much more.

For me, it’s no issue only having 11 gears as long as the lowest gear goes low enough, and the highest is high enough for my trips. The gaps between gears can be large when you’re working with fewer gears, but if it’s set up right, it’s manageable even when hauling a heavy load. The only time I’ve ever been annoyed with my lack of gears is on bigger hills, such as Wilson between Rosslyn and Courthouse, when I wished I had a tiny bit more refinement than I did between my 2 lowest gears. Otherwise I’ve made it up that hill, Braddock Rd between Commonwealth and King, and other decently sized hills hauling groceries and other heavy loads without problems. And my bike is likely heavier than yours to start with, so if I can make it up a hill with 11 gears, so can you.

(in case it matters, below is the gear ratio I’m working with and have found to be perfectly adequate around DC).
Gear 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11
Ratio 0.527 0.681 0.770 0.878 0.995 1.134 1.292 1.462 1.667 1.888 2.153

November 18, 2015 at 9:24 pm #1041410

Lt. Dan
Participant

I run a Raceface Narrow/Wide chainring on my mountain bike in a 1×9 setup. In two years, I have dropped my chain MAYBE three times!! If you go to a 1x setup be sure to get a narrow/wide chainring up front!!

November 18, 2015 at 9:38 pm #1041411

mstone
Participant

I’ll echo Dismal: that sounds like a much bigger expense than just going with something like an 11/42 ten speed. Why not try that and see if you actually need the extra gear? If you ever use the full range of your current setup, you’re going to be sad with this because you’ll have a narrower range. My personal preference would be to try to tune the gearing so that you just don’t use the front very often: stay in the big ring if you’re unloaded, and use the small ring for loaded touring. That means keeping track of what ratios you’re using, then calculating the best combination of chainrings and cassette.

November 18, 2015 at 10:31 pm #1041413

dasgeh
Participant

@Steve O 128209 wrote:

[ATTACH=CONFIG]10106[/ATTACH]

This, BTW, is called a “chain watcher”, in case anyone needs to google it. Took me far to long to figure that out (it didn’t help that I thought everyone was saying “chain washer”).

November 19, 2015 at 2:48 am #1041428

bluerider
Participant

Thanks everyone. Still not particularly close to making a decision about this. Need to play around with Sheldon Brown’s gear calculator.

November 19, 2015 at 4:15 am #1041430

hozn
Participant

I switched my commuter to 1×10, using an X9 RD, a 11-36t cassette and a 46t X-SYNC ring up front. This yields slightly more range than an 11-28 with a 36/46 setup.

I am very happy with this setup.

The narrow-wide ring is the way to go. The SRAM (x-sync) rings shift the chainline inboard a bit, which makes for less extreme angles in the big cogs.

Going [SRAM] 10sp let me just mix road and mtb components. I am using an Apex shifter and a S500 brake lever (basically Apex with the paddle removed). And the X9 type 2 (clutch) RD really is quite nice.

Only downside is that the X9 doesn’t have a barrel adjuster on it, so had to add an inline adjuster. Also I do notice the gaps; the 11-36 smaller cogs have 2-tooth increments and there are one or two cogs that I wish I had. An 11s might help, but would introduce way more complexity and cost.

I love not having the FD and love not dropping my chain when riding singletrack.

November 19, 2015 at 2:26 pm #1041443

NicDiesel
Participant

@hozn 128235 wrote:

I love not having the FD and love not dropping my chain when riding singletrack.

This. I’m running a triple(!) on my road bike (I’m super fat so hills == pain) but on my fat bike I’m switching it over to a 1×10 just to get away from the chain drop. The biggest issue you might run into is tire rub but I doubt you’re planning to run tires wide enough for that to be an issue.

November 19, 2015 at 2:36 pm #1041444

bluerider
Participant

Thanks everyone. I know everything will technically work. It’s just hard to find information from anyone who has done this on a touring bike carrying 30 or so lbs. Tons of info on cross bikes, mountain bike, and road bikes. But I haven’t seen anyone do this on a touring bike which regularly carries loads. I just have to wonder how it would work. I don’t use the 28 tooth small ring on the crank much but when I need it….I REALLY NEED IT. I think my best course of action will be to use the gearing calculator and dug in. My guess is that achieving a similar range will be easy, it will be the jumps between gears will be of concern especially when loaded.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]10110[/ATTACH]

November 19, 2015 at 2:48 pm #1041445

DismalScientist
Participant

On your current setup, your high gear (42-12) has a ratio 4.5 times your low gear (28-36). To get an equivalent range, you would need a 10-45 cassette in back with only one chain ring.

November 19, 2015 at 3:06 pm #1041448

bluerider
Participant

@DismalScientist 128250 wrote:

On your current setup, your high gear (42-12) has a ratio 4.5 times your low gear (28-36). To get an equivalent range, you would need a 10-45 cassette in back with only one chain ring.

Interesting….thanks a lot. So if I went from a 42 tooth ring (my current big ring) down to a 34 or 36 tooth single ring with a 10-42 cassette I might be in the ballpark. Granted I would sacrifice some top-end speed for additional low-end grunt.

Again, the gaps between each cogs will really tell the tale here. I so like the idea of simplification on this bike.

November 19, 2015 at 3:09 pm #1041449

bluerider
Participant

@hozn 128235 wrote:

I switched my commuter to 1×10, using an X9 RD, a 11-36t cassette and a 46t X-SYNC ring up front. This yields slightly more range than an 11-28 with a 36/46 setup.

I am very happy with this setup.

The narrow-wide ring is the way to go. The SRAM (x-sync) rings shift the chainline inboard a bit, which makes for less extreme angles in the big cogs.

Going [SRAM] 10sp let me just mix road and mtb components. I am using an Apex shifter and a S500 brake lever (basically Apex with the paddle removed). And the X9 type 2 (clutch) RD really is quite nice.

Only downside is that the X9 doesn’t have a barrel adjuster on it, so had to add an inline adjuster. Also I do notice the gaps; the 11-36 smaller cogs have 2-tooth increments and there are one or two cogs that I wish I had. An 11s might help, but would introduce way more complexity and cost.

I love not having the FD and love not dropping my chain when riding singletrack.

Hozn, do you use this bike loaded? Interesting to note, I already own a pair of 10 speed Apex shifters and a pair of S500s currently on the Vaya.

November 19, 2015 at 3:14 pm #1041432

mstone
Participant

@bluerider 128253 wrote:

Interesting….thanks a lot. So if I went from a 42 tooth ring (my current big ring) down to a 34 or 36 tooth single ring with a 10-42 cassette I might be in the ballpark. Granted I would sacrifice some top-end speed for additional low-end grunt.

Right, hence the question about whether you use both ends of the current range–you’re the only one who can decide whether losing that is a good tradeoff. FWIW, a front derailleur doesn’t really do that much; if you’re having problems I’d tend to suspect there’s something else going on, like the chain/gears are worn out. (Assuming you’re basically on-road, heavy MTB use bounces the chain around more.)

November 19, 2015 at 3:21 pm #1041433

jabberwocky
Participant

One thing to consider is something like an OneUp or Wolf Tooth wide range 1×10, coupled with a wide-narrow chainring. Basically they sell a 42t granny ring that goes behind the 36t on an 11-36 MTB cassette, and you ditch one of the smaller cogs, leaving you with an 11-42 cassette. I run this setup on my trail bike and it works very well and almost gives the same range as a normal 2×10 setup.

http://www.oneupcomponents.com/products/42-tooth-sprocket
http://www.wolftoothcomponents.com/products/giant-cog-for-shimano
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