Thinking of training for a tri

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  • December 4, 2011 at 12:55 pm #933288
    slowtriguy
    Participant

    @SteveTheTech 11592 wrote:

    I’ve got a few question for the locals who’ve participated/competed in the DC area.

    -Be honest…how bad is swimming in the Potomac?

    I’ve only raced two triathlons so far — just started in the 2011 season — but I have had a blast with both. This year, I raced the DC Triathlon sprint distance (http://www.dctri.com/), and the Giant Acorn International distance. Both were fun races; the DC Triathlon was a great novice race for me, as it was close, flat, and very well organized.

    Swimming in the Potomac wasn’t bad for me personally. The water is very murky – to the point where I literally could not see my hand at the end of my arm when I reached forward in my swimming strokes; it’s that murky. That was a bit freaky at first, but I got used to it quickly. The water was warm for our race, about 77 degrees F, and there was a moderate current. Last year, the swim course was 800 meters long, with the first 200 meters or so being upstream, then a long downstream segment, then the final about 100 meters or so being upstream again.

    -Is it even possible to maintain a decent swimming form with many other people flailing around within striking range? (I am brought back to being 5 and swimming in the pool at the Y)

    Since my version of “decent swimming form” would make any real swimmer laugh out loud, I’m probably not the best to answer. However, the DC Triathlon swim start last year was a time trial, with only a few swimmers entering the water at any one time. Basically, we walked to the end of a pier floating in the river, jumped in (triggering the timing chip to start recording us), and immediately started swimming. I personally didn’t have any major kicks or punches during the swim start.

    I did have eggbeater syndrome in the Giant Acorn race this fall, which used a wave start with about 50 of us in the water at once. But even that wasn’t too bad.

    I’m such a slow swimmer that by the time I was 200-300 meters in, the pack had thinned out, and I didn’t have too many interactions with folks. If you’re a faster swimmer and would stay with the more aggressive folks, you might have to deal with folks kicking or punching or swimming overtop of you.

    -What is the transition like from swimming to cycling? I can’t help but feel like the stink would linger.

    For the DC Tri, we swam into another floating pier right near the first one, then ran up a set of mats toward the transition area. We had the option of going through a set of showers to rinse off, which I did. Some didn’t. Yes, it did give me pause to think we were running through decontamination showers, but it was more something to joke about than anything else.

    While running to my bike, I stripped off my swim cap and goggles, unzipped my wetsuit, and pulled it down to my waist. I swam wearing triathlon shorts under my wetsuit, so when I got to the bike, I just had to pull off the wetsuit; pull on my bike jersey, socks, shoes, and helmet; and jog the bike out of transition. You jog the bike up to the line where the nice volunteers tell you to mount up, and off you go.

    -What is the last transition like? Usually after a long ride I don’t think the best thing to do is run away from the car…

    At the end of the bike course, there’s a line where you dismount; more nice volunteers reminding you there. Then jog the bike into the transition, rerack it, strip off your bike gear, and put on your running gear. Head back out onto the running course.

    The hardest part of this transition for me was the first 500 meters of running. My legs were a bit tired from the bike, so I was a bit stiff and wobbly for the start of the run. I had been practicing this transition for a few weeks before the race, which did help, but let’s face it: there’s a reason such back-to-back workouts are called “bricks”.

    Once I warmed up, the running went fine, if slow. [Notice a theme — there’s a reason for my forum ID ;) ]

    Shoot me a PM if you want more info.

    December 4, 2011 at 3:24 pm #933289
    CCrew
    Participant

    @SteveTheTech 11592 wrote:

    -Be honest…how bad is swimming in the Potomac?

    Swimming in black water (where you can’t see or reference the bottom) is a totally different experience than swimming in a pool. It can and does freak some folks out. Personally I think if I were you I’d look at getting in on some of the sprint tri’s just to get accustomed. There are a lot held at the GMU Fitness center in Manassas every couple of weekends in season.

    Transitions can make or break a race, and it depends on whether you’re using a wetsuit or not as to how tough transition 1 is. T2 is usually much easier. Nice part is that they can certainly be practiced. Son got them down to under 45 seconds..

    My son made Team USA for USAT two years ago, I’ve seen more than a few races :)

    But to directly answer the Potomac question, you’re good until another arm grows out of your back :p

    December 4, 2011 at 5:04 pm #933290
    creadinger
    Participant

    @CCrew 11599 wrote:

    But to directly answer the Potomac question, you’re good until another arm grows out of your back :p

    Wouldn’t another arm be a good thing? At least on the swim leg? The more oars in the boat, the faster you can go. Heh.

    December 4, 2011 at 6:11 pm #933291
    PotomacCyclist
    Participant

    +1 on visibility/psychology being the main challenge of swimming in the Potomac. As far as open water conditions go, the Potomac is mild. The current is not that strong and the waves aren’t bad. (If the current is strong because of recent heavy rains, the swim is likely to be canceled as it was at this year’s Nation’s Triathlon.)

    A local group at National Harbor offers open water swim lessons and practice sessions. Other groups, such as Sports + Spinal Physical Therapy in DC, offer occasional OWS lessons at more distant locations like Sandy Point state park in MD. (“OWS” is used to abbreviate “open water swimming”, not Occupy Wall Street. At least in the triathlon/marathon swimming world.)

    I think both the Washington DC Triathlon and the Nation’s Triathlon will use time trial starts next year. So you won’t have the washing machine effect that you see at the large races like the Ironman World Championship in Kona, Hawaii. You’ll still encounter other swimmers along the course but it’s not that bad. One tip is to put your goggles on first, before the mandatory swim cap. This will keep anyone from knocking your goggles off unintentionally. (Most contact in the water is unintentional.) If you use a wetsuit, put the timing chip/ankle strap on under the wetsuit.

    The WDC Tri is particularly beginner-friendly. I believe they installed a temporary rest dock about 300m along the course for people to use in case of panic. (If a swimmer gets tired after swimming 300m, that person is not properly trained for the race. But some people will struggle with the lack of visibility and pool walls.)

    ***

    Temperature should not be a problem. The WDC Tri may or may not be wetsuit-legal. I would prepare as if it will not be wetsuit-legal. But get used to wearing a wetsuit anyway, if you decide to get one.

    Use landmarks to guide you on the swim. Even though the DC races have very large buoys every 100m, it’s still difficult to see them until you are within 20-30m. You can use Memorial Bridge to sight. I think you can see the Lincoln Memorial from the water, but I don’t remember.

    ***
    Unless there has been a recent heavy rainstorm, the water is not polluted, at least at the WDC/Nation’s Tri course. But there is a lot of mud and sediment in the river. I probably wouldn’t wear a white outfit for the race. You may never be able to get the brown color out of the garments. If it’s not wetsuit-legal, I just wear tri shorts on the swim, with no jersey on top. I put it on in Transition 1 (T1). The front zips down most of the way, which makes it easier to put on when wet. If you choose to do this, be sure to practice putting on the jersey when you are already wet.

    (During heavy rainstorms, the storm sewer water gets combined with the regular sewer system. The combined flow enters the Potomac and pollutes the river. If this happens, race organizers will cancel the swim. They monitor water quality throughout the final week.)

    T1

    A common recommendation is to start kicking more in the final 50m of the swim. That gets more blood flowing to your legs before you get out of the water and start running to transition. I’ve never had any issues with the swim/bike transition but some people do.

    T2

    Some people shift to an easier gear toward the end of the bike and start spinning at a higher cadence, to shake out the legs and get the blood flowing. You may also want to sit up a bit and loosen up your back before you near the bike dismount area.

    As you pointed out, it’s not natural to go for a fast run immediately after a hard bike ride. But since this is an important part of triathlon, it’s worth training that transition. That’s the point of a brick workout, where you do two different sports back-to-back. The most common brick is a bike/run workout. You can also do a swim/bike brick, but that’s trickier if you don’t have a bike set up next to the pool or river. You can also do back-and-forth bricks. Over the winter, you could do a bike/run/bike/run… indoor brick using a spin bike (or bike trainer) and a treadmill. If you’re using a gym, go there at off-peak hours. Otherwise, you’re likely to find all of the bikes or treadmills in use.

    ***

    Note that it’s illegal to swim in the Potomac River in the DC area unless you are with a group that has a special permit. I think the National Harbor group is the only permitted group in the immediate DC area. The DC triathlons usually have a practice swim session the day before the race. (But not this year, apparently because of construction work/planning activities related to the opening of the Martin Luther King Memorial in West Potomac Park.)

    You have enough time to prepare for the sprint distance, or even the Olympic distance, at the WDC Tri. There are other races in Va. and Md. too, but obviously if you live in or near DC, WDC and the Nation’s Tri are the most convenient.

    December 5, 2011 at 1:28 am #933293
    SteveTheTech
    Participant

    Oh you guys are great, thanks a bunch for the incite.

    This one looks really fun and not too intimidating as a first.
    http://www.setupevents.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=event_detail&eventID=2033

    This one has a warning about hills but I really enjoy a challenging ride. Plus the combo of bike/run/bike/run looks pretty wild. I wonder if doing both would be possible…
    http://www.setupevents.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=event_detail&eventID=1841

    I know the structure is a race by nature but I would be looking to just complete one for the first try. I say this now though when the time comes my overly competitive nature will change that. Friendly competition against yourself and the clock is a much more interesting goal than just riding a hundred miles (which is what I was actively training).

    I feel like I could flounder my way through a couple hundred meters of steady water well within the allotted time. Swimming has got to be my biggest mental hurdle, I do not much care for breathing while trying to make forward progress in the water. Running just seems like it would suck but unless my form and/or shoes are wrong I’ll be able to get it. The only kind of swimming I really have any confidence in is wading in 3′ of water on the way to the swim up bar.

    Is increasing swimming distance like accumulating distance on a bicycle?
    The first few hundred yards are the hardest then the rest are not easy per say but getting into a rhythm makes it much more tolerable.

    Running I assume feels slow and boring compared to sailing along in the 20 mph range. Running a full marathon sounds ok but running 26.2 miles for practice sounds awful boring. I’m sure like when you get complacent you get hurt though, using anything other than full focus and concentration seems like it can get costly…quick.

    Adding the concept of a brick workout sounds interesting, not fun or like any sort of good idea but interesting and beneficial. I was worried about getting cycling shorts contaminated with river/lake/ocean water and causing the worst saddle sores known to man (literally). The idea of using a smaller wetsuit (from knees to elbows) is ideal (at least in planning phase) with a bib or whatever is appropriate under.
    My complex has a gym that overlooks a indoor lap pool, that I have only used separately….I can no longer come up with a reason not too combine them. Although I’m sure to catch an odd look I could set up a transition area to practice. But as mentioned above treadmills are very popular in all gyms.

    December 5, 2011 at 1:40 pm #933307
    creadinger
    Participant

    I don’t know anything about triathlons but a friend of mine did this event this year and had a good time(fun, not fast).

    It’s in Purcellville and instead of swimming in the river the swim snakes through a pool with a time-trial like start. They start you by estimated swimming speed, so that faster folks go first and the slow people don’t stack everyone up. It works in theory…

    http://www.active.com/triathlon/purcellville-va/tri-the-valley-sprint-triathlon-2012-my482

    Anyway, an option if you’re interested and skeeved out by swimming in the Potomac.

    December 5, 2011 at 4:16 pm #933323
    Tim Kelley
    Participant

    Swimming in the Potomac is okay. Water visibility can be limited to just past the tip of your fingers and as others have said that can be a bit disorienting. Definitely do a Sprint distance race leading up to it. If you’re looking to get involved with a group, both DC Tri Club and Team Z have beginners programs.

    Be careful though–it’s a slippery slope. I did Nation’s Tri my first year and by the second year I found myself in the middle of full Ironman training…

    December 5, 2011 at 6:25 pm #933333
    CCrew
    Participant

    @creadinger 11622 wrote:

    I don’t know anything about triathlons but a friend of mine did this event this year and had a good time(fun, not fast).

    It’s in Purcellville and instead of swimming in the river the swim snakes through a pool with a time-trial like start. They start you by estimated swimming speed, so that faster folks go first and the slow people don’t stack everyone up. It works in theory…

    http://www.active.com/triathlon/purcellville-va/tri-the-valley-sprint-triathlon-2012-my482

    Anyway, an option if you’re interested and skeeved out by swimming in the Potomac.

    Unless they broke it this year my son was holding the course record on that one. :)

    December 5, 2011 at 7:24 pm #933334
    PotomacCyclist
    Participant

    As long as you can comfortably make the cutoff times, you don’t have to worry about your time. 99 percent of the participants won’t have a realistic shot at winning. Since it will be your first race, you will automatically get a PR (personal record), assuming you finish.

    Swimming is a very technical sport, much more than cycling is. While you’ll still need to develop some swim-specific endurance and speed, you should focus on technique. If you don’t have decent technique, endurance isn’t going to matter much. Bad technique will cause you to waste a lot of energy going nowhere fast. Bad form can also lead to shoulder problems. Learn proper technique and you’ll find it easier to swim long distances. You will avoid shoulder problems too. Look up body position and kicking drills to start off. Work on catch and pull, and sculling drills too.

    The tricky part about running is the higher-impact nature of the sport. If you increase your weekly mileage or single workout mileage too quickly, you risk developing overuse injuries. You’ll probably have to start out at a very basic level. Since you have good aerobic endurance from cycling, you are likely to get very frustrated with your progress with running. You have a strong engine but the legs aren’t tough enough to handle high-mileage running yet. You won’t need to run anywhere close to 26 miles in training to prepare for a sprint or Olympic triathlon. I wouldn’t run that long at all this coming year, if I were you. While some people manage to work their way up to marathon distance in a year, it’s not recommended. The risk of injury goes up greatly if you try to rush it.

    For a sprint tri, the run will be in the 5K to 8K range (3-5 miles). If you just want to finish the race, I think you would be OK with a long run in the 5-7 mile range. Don’t jump up to 5 miles right away. Follow some sort of beginner program where you increase distance gradually. You may not want to increase mileage/time every week. If you jump up slightly and then stay at that level for a couple weeks, your legs get a chance to adapt to the training stimulus. For an Olympic tri, the run is usually 10K (6.2 miles). For shorter races, it’s better to get your long run up past the race distance, but only if you have enough weeks before the race. (For marathons, very few amateurs will try to run the full distance in training. The risk of injury is too great.)

    ***
    Try to keep your run workouts varied. Don’t do the same exact thing every day, running the same mileage at the same speed on the same flat road. Rolling hills can vary the load on your legs while building up some run-specific leg strength. Running on unpaved trails can lessen the stress of running, though you should do much of your running on asphalt if your race will be on asphalt. Keep to a moderate effort or pace for most of your runs. Some beginners try to sprint in every run workout. That’s a really bad idea. It’s likely to get you injured very quickly. You could add some speedwork in the month or two leading up to the race, but I wouldn’t do too much of that over the winter. If you do some limited faster running, be sure to warm up first. In warm weather, I like to run easy for at least 10 minutes before doing any speedwork. In the winter, I will warm up even longer, up to 20-25 minutes. (However, I rarely do speedwork in the winter.)

    If you run on treadmills, vary the elevation throughout the workout. You don’t need to go crazy with it. Just bump up the elevation grade by a percent or two every 5 or 10 minutes or whenever. That relieves boredom. It also varies the load on your legs and helps to simulate rolling hills. I would probably keep the elevation at a moderate level, maybe changing from 1% to 3 or 4%.

    Running drills and strides can be useful. So can basic strength training (which is not the same as bodybuilding).

    December 7, 2011 at 2:58 am #933417
    SteveTheTech
    Participant

    @Tim Kelley 11639 wrote:

    If you’re looking to get involved with a group, both DC Tri Club and Team Z have beginners programs.

    Be careful though–it’s a slippery slope. I did Nation’s Tri my first year and by the second year I found myself in the middle of full Ironman training…

    I imagine that the color/consistence/salinity make the swim more of a challenge. After all if it were easy more people would do it. I think I’ll look more closely into the Old Town Tri Club, I don’t think I am competitive enough for a DC based club. :) I do however fear that as with most of the hobbies I get into I will get bit by a bug and only a major injury would change my tune….oh it was so much easier being an overweight chain smokering bar fly.

    @PotomacCyclist 11652 wrote:

    Swimming is a very technical sport, much more than cycling is. While you’ll still need to develop some swim-specific endurance and speed, you should focus on technique.

    The tricky part about running is the higher-impact nature of the sport. If you increase your weekly mileage or single workout mileage too quickly, you risk developing overuse injuries. You’ll probably have to start out at a very basic level.

    It is clear you have a passion for this type of excise and I greatly appreciate your incite and help.

    At this point I thinking I am going to pay someone to teach my wife and I basic stroke technique. I tend to absorb bad behavior quickly. Swimming sucks, but loosing crucial energy (and after the first few, time) needlessly due to bad form seems like a really bad way to start a(even a sprint length) tri. I’d rather not half ass this, my wife has MS and I have a very physically demanding job so it would be smart on our part to get as much initial help as possible, starting out the right way.

    I had only started casually reading about the proper way to get into running. It seems like there are several ways to hurt yourself, it’s time consuming and can be monotonous…yet people love it. I do not plan on attempting to move any faster than a quick jog without a pair of new shoes and a proper fitment from a running store. There is a low impact 1 mile measured trail in my condo complex I think that the first month or so of training will be completed there. Seems like most people say to I like the idea of starting with a timing schedule instead of speed and distance, as a car guy I tend to be a speed freak. Although I am very interested in tracking my pace to monitor progress.

    Over the next few weeks I’m sure we will begin to form a training plan that starts slow with some mild cross training until the bikems ride in June then we’ll probably focus more on the run swim disaster that shall be unavoidable.

    Guess the chances of next year being the year I don’t kill everything in the garden have gone down way earlier than last year. haha.

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