Broken frame story and such

[bikeeveryday]

Glad to hear that Nashbar is replacing the bike completely. They could have just replaced the frameset…

[Orestes Munn]

According to my meager knowledge, lugged frames ar brazed; whereas, unlugged ones are welded. Does this make a difference to the amount of embrittlement, which takes place or doesn’t take place near tube joints?

[Crickey7]

@Orestes Munn 101596 wrote:

According to my meager knowledge, lugged frames ar brazed; whereas, unlugged ones are welded. Does this make a difference to the amount of embrittlement, which takes place or doesn’t take place near tube joints?

Sheldon Brown implies they are much stronger because you never melt the metal at the joint. The tubes are shaped, cut and fitted over the frame tube, then the brazing material is drawn into the .15 mm gap by capillary action.

[mstone]

@Orestes Munn 101596 wrote:

According to my meager knowledge, lugged frames ar brazed; whereas, unlugged ones are welded. Does this make a difference to the amount of embrittlement, which takes place or doesn’t take place near tube joints?

Everything depends on the material & the skill. It’s possible to braze using silver at low temperatures (under 1000 degrees), which is an advantage for older alloys. (You won’t find those alloys used much on high-end frames these days, and low end frames aren’t going to be silver brazed so it’s mostly moot.) For the air hardened stuff, you want the weld to get hot (like 1500+ degrees) in order to exercise the air hardening properties. With lugs you heat a larger area, with tig you use a thicker tube. In the end, it’s mostly aesthetics. If the builder screws up and overheats or underheats the weld, you’ll have problems no matter what the material is, and you won’t know until it fails.

@jabberwocky 101592 wrote:

Yeah, I’m not totally up on my steel welding, I just know what the manufacturers have told me when I talked to them post-break. All three were relatively high-end bikes (one was a true-temper OX Lemond and two were custom MTB frames). All were sort of lightweight for steel, which was probably what doomed them. My DJ bike will likely last forever, since the frame weighs like 8 pounds.

Yeah, the true temper OX is their equivalent to reynolds 853, and shouldn’t get weaker just because it’s welded. It’s likely that it was just too thin for you. (The highest stress areas happen to be near the welds, so any breaks are more likely there than in a low stress spot in the middle.) If you ever do get another steel bike you should make sure you tell them that you eat frames so they spec a thicker tubing.

[jabberwocky]

@mstone 101600 wrote:

Yeah, the true temper OX is their equivalent to reynolds 853, and shouldn’t get weaker just because it’s welded. It’s likely that it was just too thin for you. (The highest stress areas happen to be near the welds, so any breaks are more likely there than in a low stress spot in the middle.) If you ever do get another steel bike you should make sure you tell them that you eat frames so they spec a thicker tubing.

FWIW, the custom steel MTB frame, I told them not to worry about weight, and that I was an aggressive mofo and wanted a strong frame. Not sure what tubing they used, but it wasn’t all that light. Still broke that one. They warrantied it and built me a whole new frame, with additional reinforcing. I broke it again, in the same spot. I’ve decided to stick with carbon and aluminum for the mountain bikes. Never had an issue with either aside from snapping an ISCG mount off the aluminum DH bike.

[sethpo]

@sethpo 101553 wrote:

Yup. My purpose in posting this was to share an overall positive experience with the bike and how Nashbar is taking care of me. I paid $631 for the thing w/ 105 group. I replaced the canti brakes w/ V-brakes, the BB, and the stock wheels weren’t great. All in (not counting chains, chainrings, brakes pads, tires, pedals and saddle) I’m at about $850 for the bike that would cost double that w/ lesser components in a name brand like Janis or All-City. And now I’m getting a brand new replacement bike with no questions asked.

I’m pleased.

Update: I shipped the bike last Saturday using a Nashbar supplied UPS label. It arrived in Ohio on Wednesday and they sent out the replacement today. I’ll have it by the 24th. I am so impressed with their customer service.

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